About SRGB

Question for you. I'm really trying hard to develop a great color work flow. I realized after my new discovery I didn't to proof my photoshop files under Blurb's cmyk profile any longer. I went under Proofing and selected the calibration I have done with my X-rite colormunki. I realize under custom is the whole array of choices from the default Apple RGB to selecting the calibration colormunkit profile I do every two weeks with my X-Rite Colormunki. I just realized there are other settings I can select as well. One being the legacy Macintosh RGB Gamma 1.8. then Internet Standard RGB (SRGB), and finally Monitor RGB. the second of first choice
This question has gotten more intense for me. Since I'm working in Photoshop on files for my website should I set the monitor to Internet Standard RGB (sRGB) when I'm color correcting and adjusting my files for the web. Also should I go under custom and select the X-Rite Colormunki profile? Also since I'm going to only use SRGB files for Blurb books and not use Blurb's Icc profile any longer. Should I also select the Internet Standard RGB (sRGB) as for my monitor while adjusting my files for Blurb books or leave it as one of the other two legacy Macintosh RGB Gamma 1.8 etc?
Help
Now again I'm wondering when I'm printing files for my Epson printers should I select legacy Macintosh RGB Gamma 1.8 or monitor RGB. Also should I choice the X-rite calibrated profile. I know when I'm in the Epson driver I go and select the printer profile for the printing paper I will be using.

hi,
your hardware-profiled (device-specific) monitor profile should always be highlighted in System Preferences> Displays> Color: Display Profile — never set your monitor profile to device-independent profiles like sRGB, AdobeRGB
forget anything to do with 1.8 Mac legacy gamma...profile your monitor to something like 6000 kelvin, D60, 2.2 gamma, luminance 120 cdm2
for the Web, always Edit> Convert to sRGB (if not already there), then File> Save for Web & Devices — include the sRGB ICC profile or not (i usually strip the profile for the Web)
Photoshop already displays sRGB 'accurately' so i wouldn't get too caught up in second guessing that for Web publishing
here is some reading
basic theory (Photoshop color management)
save for web (see profiles in action)
5 simple steps to profile enlightenment (assign or convert profiles)
Photoshop Manages Colors print workflow (Source> Print Profile)
when you come back, i will recommend you only discuss one point at a time and include screenshots...

Similar Messages

RGB vs. sRGB color profile

When I select an image from my PSE organizer to be edited, the image that has a RGB color profile will come into the editor with saturated/altered greens, whereas the image with a sRGB color profile will not. Please explain.

You may need to change your color settings.
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/PhotoshopElements/8.0/Win/Using/WSae2ea3b149d0c3591ae939f10386 0b3d59-7fed_WIN.html
Interesting article about sRGB vs Adobe RGB...well as interesting as it can be on this type of subject.
http://www.smugmug.com/help/srgb-versus-adobe-rgb-1998

Adding a new device profile, a camera, to ColorSync

I recently purchased a Canon 40D digital SLR. It allows you to select the color space you want assigned to your image files -- I selected RGB. When you open the ColorSync utility there's a tab for devices and a list that includes 'camera'.
How to I add my DSLR so it shows up in ColorSync?
I keep hacking away at trying to have a color managed workflow. This stuff ain't easy, in my view.
Greg

The lack of clearly written documentation about color management is one of my pet peeves.
Often recommended with perhaps more information than you ever wanted: *Real World Color Management* by Bruce Fraser.
Color Management Info is a good online resource.
What you say about sRGB vs RGB is news.
My recommendation to stick with sRGB rather than AdobeRGB in the beginning is based not only on my own experiences, but mostly feedback in user forums such as this.
Somewhere people may have read or heard that "AdobeRGB is what the pros use", so they just adopt that without thinking. Truth is though that most commercial printing services assume sRGB and even ignore any colour profiles in images – frustration guaranteed.
It's a different story when you print at home in a closed workflow where you can control every stage of the process.
It all starts with calibrating your screen. And if you want to make the most of your images, you will probably start shooting RAW, if you're not doing so already.

Photoshop CMYK different than online converters?

Hi. I have a very weird problem here.
When I try to convert RGB to CMYK in JavaScript code or existing online converters I always get the same and what I assume is the correct result.
Example is: 69, 25, 209 > 67, 88, 0, 18
But when I do it in Photoshop, I get: 83, 84, 0, 0
Can anyone explain why this happens? I assume Photoshop is the correct one and sets the standard, but its highly annoying that I cant figure out which is wrong!

John, the issues is that there is not "ONE" RGB and "ONE" CYMK. (unlike what the website might make you believe)
It's like you say "Green" there are countless greens, the ones from grass, from a palm tree, from the top or the bottom of a leaf... blueish greens, yellowish ones.
Likewise, there are many "Blue" colors, in a sky, it would vary with the moment of the day, how close to the horizon you are.
What you are asking is how comes Photoshop and one online converter does not agree for the amount of yellow one needs to add to convert blue paint to green.
You need to state exactly what blue and what green you are talking about, and that is the question people ask you here.
The RGB and the CYMK you are talking about will make the numbers vary greatly!
So to convert from RGB to CYMK, you need to tell from which color spaces you are talking about: sRGB, adobeRGB, ProPhotoRGB... and the CYMK you are converting to: the one for an offset press, for flexography, for a given set of ink and paper, etc.
A given color will have (way) different values in sRGB, AdobeRGB, or ProPhotoRGB, and also for SWOP, FOGRA... CYMK spaces.
and 125.210.056 will be a different color in sRGB, aRGB, ProPhoto, etc.
Try to find some Color Management 101 or primers and read about them:
http://www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=1321842&seqNum=5
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/photoshop/cs/using/WSfd1234e1c4b69f30ea53e41001031ab64-73eea.h tml
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/creativesuite/cs/using/WS6A727430-9717-42df-B578-C0AC705C54F0. html#WS380A271D-1873-4fe1-B1B3-44F76281CCBE

Monitor ICC Profiles

Greetings Adobe People!
I've been working with Photoshop since version 6.0, I know people quite often use that as bragging rights and I guess, that's what I'm doing, please forgive mefor doing so. Just trying to state in some term that I think I'm somewhat wise in a few of the ways of :Photoshop. I've read a few books here and there about what I should do for monitor ICC Profiles, I have a Gretag Macbeth, Eye-One Display 2 and I use it to calibrate my laptop and desktop monitor every couple of weeks. I stumbled upon an old picture I had made for some friends in CS2 I believe, a few years back, when I didn't have my Gretag and I was *GASP* calibrating my monitor using Adobe Gamma! When I load the psd file the colors are vibrant and stunning, when I load the associated jpg the colors are dull and extremely muted. Now I'm using Adobe RGB 1998, we could go on all day about sRGB and Adobe RGB and the slew of others that are out there, but at the end of the day it's really just personal preference, much like football fans or people who bicker over why X sports car is better than Y road car, what I'm asking is just keep it to your self if you don't mind doing so. If I select the most recent of my monitor profiles the colors return to there natural glory in both the jpg and the psd file, but I've heard for printing you need to have your RGB set to either sRGB or Adobe RGB 1998 and then print from your printer profile... When I do go to print I've got it down to a pretty good science of getting things done, so it doesn't take me too long to do it and I really don't pay too much attention anymore as to what I'm doing. I could go through the steps here, but I'm sure those that are familiar with it, know what I'm talking about. So all of this typing is leading to this, is it ok to just use my monitor profile for my main profile or should I stick with Adobe RGB 1998 and if I stick with Adobe RGB 1998, how can I get the muted colors to show up like they do in the psd file for the jpg file. Sorry for typing so much, and please take all the time you need to get back to me, I'm in no rush at all... Take care!
- Me

Keep using your EyeOne to calibrate, but don't use that monitor profile as a working space. That's not what it was designed for. Stick with the sRGB or Adobe RGB as your working space. As to your legacy file, this is where the Assign Profile can come into good use. Try using Assign Profile to find the working space that makes your old file looks its best. Then you can either leave it in that space or convert to your preferred working space. As to printing, it won't make a hell of a lot of difference whether you use Adobe RGB, sRGB or something else. It's more important that you've properly calibrated and that you are using a good (preferably custom) printer profile while printing.

Color shift when going to the web?

I spent 2 hours yesterday trying to get a graphic I had done in illustrator to export for use on the web. No matter what I did, the color always shifted - it looked like a gamma or lightening thing. The thing is, I'm not a noob to graphics or the web, I've been doing this professionally for over 10 years. But either CS3, or my recent move to the Mac, or something... has completely thrown a wrench in the works. The final response from Tech Support was that it was inevitable, and that was it. ?? What? That makes no sense.
Here's the lowdown: Illustrator document is set to RGB color space. I tried the standard color profile, and also tried setting it to unmanaged. I then tried both export and 'save for web'. I always get this shift. Everything is lighter. soo.. I then tried taking it over to Photoshop and saving from there. Strangely, it looked right in Photoshop, and then still wouldn't export without lightening everything.
Ultimately, nothing worked. What am I missing?

Here are a couple of good links about sRGB and color spaces in general.
http://www.color.org/sRGB.xalter
http://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/color_spaces.htm
The first one gets pretty technical after a few paragraphs; don't worry about the more technical aspects, just read the first part.
To make a long story short, the reason we create in or convert to sRGB before posting to the Web is that it has become a standard reference space for work that is intended to be displayed on monitors. No individual monitor behaves exactly as sRGB describes, but historically it was developed to be a good average color space that most monitors can achieve, or come close to.
When you go to choose a hex color for a web page, if you watch what you are doing, you will notice that the same color has a different hex code for every different color space you might try out. For instance, I have a client that uses PMS 109C in their logo and all their packaging. The only way I can select a hex color for that PMS color in a reproducible manner is to choose that color in a defined working space.
For the Web, we have all already agreed that working space should be sRGB. If I chose that color in my monitor's display space used as a working space, it would be different on every different machine I have available to me. I work on 4 different monitors, so I personally could potentially choose four different translations of that color. Which would be correct? None of them, because each monitor is different, each has a different profile, and so each would give me a different translation of the same color. So I need to make that translation while working in a standard working space. I can either select my color directly in sRGB, or I can select it in Adobe RGB (or another standardized working space that actually contains that color), and convert the entire file to sRGB before publishing to the web. Either approach works.
Since sRGB has the 2.2 gamma, you want to set your display to 2.2 so you won't see a lightening of the image when you view it without a profile.
why strip the profile? As far as I am concerned, you often do not have to, but under some circumstances will want to.
For photographs, illustrations, and paintings I leave the profile on jpegs, because color managed browsers will display them more accurately with the profile embedded. This is particularly true of Safari, for reasons I have already stated.
For graphics that need to match hex colors, I leave the profile off, because safari does not color manage hex colors. so Safari will set-up a mismatch between tagged jpegs and hex colors. If you need to match a graphic to hex colors on the page, it's better to leave the profile off.
If you are working on a page or a site with very large numbers of images, you may want to leave the profile off to save on disk space and download time as well. For me that is usually not a big consideration... but for some sites it may be.

Wide-gamut displays and Thunderbolt

I returned an ASUS PA279Q wide-gamut monitor because several important advertised functions (Adobe RGB and sRGB modes) were not supported through the Thunderbolt connection on my 2013 MacBook Pro Retina (15”). ASUS support explained to me that the Thunderbolt port output was YUV rather than RBG and their calibrated modes were disabled with that output. The monitor worked perfectly on a 2009 non-Thunderbolt MacBook Air through the mini-DisplayPort.
I am now considering the NEC PA272W but it appears to be the same panel as the ASUS monitor. Could anyone confirm that the NEC can utilize its Adobe RGB and sRGB functions when connected by a mini-DisplayPort cable through a Thunderbolt port?
Or could anyone recommend another wide-gamut display that works for sure through a mini-DisplayPort/Thunderbolt connection…
Would you consider the Apple Thunderbolt Display for critical color work?
Thanks.

chris.dg wrote:
So I am curious how well the sRGB mode works? I've read reports on other NEC wide-gamut monitors that when switched into sRGB mode you lose a bit of luminance, that the reds over oversaturated, and general desktop/browser colors are obviously not "normal". Have you noticed anything of the sort with your new PA272, or in sRGB mode is it still a cream of the crop display?
I have not noticed anything odd about sRGB mode. The problems you mentioned, where colors can look horribly oversaturated or shifted, I have seen (or seen documented by others) when the monitor is in Adobe RGB mode. But that is not the fault of the monitor at all. It is always the fault of the OS or an application not adapted to work with such a wide color space, mistakenly assuming the monitor is sRGB. The colors look fine in high-end graphics apps even when the OS X desktop and web browsers look oversaturated.
But like Charles says, other features compensate for this. For example, the Adobe RGB and sRGB modes are just two of the built-in presets for the (highly accurate and factory verified) internal calibration. But you also get to store a number of your own presets. I do not even use the factory Adobe RGB and sRGB presets. I made two of my own. One I calibrated for "widest possible" gamut for photo work, at a certain luminance, the other an "sRGB emulation" preset at a completely different luminance. Because I didn't agree with the luminance of the factory presets. When you make a preset you can set the luminance, white point, gamut, etc. so if you don't like the factory presets it doesn't matter, just make your own. (Note: I am using the PA272-SV with one of the calibrator devices that actually talks to the internal monitor circuitry, so I am not sure how well this works if you get the more commonPA272 model without it and use a cheaper calibrator that only creates a profile without talking to the monitor.)
The factory Adobe RGB and sRGB presets are very useful if you don't want to get into customizing the color specifications, but any limitations they have are easily understood and remedied if you have some knowledge of color management concepts and have a compatible integrated calibrator.
What you might glean from this is that the true value of the PA272 is if you are an experienced graphics user who knows enough about color to get the most out of the monitor. If you are a casual user who just wants to flip back and forth between sRGB and Adobe RGB once in a while, things might not always work as expected and a more conventional monitors could have been a better deal. If you understand how the PA272 is designed relative to color science, and in terms of how it's an internal calibration compared to the external profiling of most monitors, the sRGB mode makes a lot of sense.
chris.dg wrote:
The PA272 has a number of key features for me: the 2560x1600 native resolution, the built-in KVM switch, DisplayPort, wide-gamut for when I want it,etc. But the only thing holding me back is whether or not I should simply stick with a "normal" gamut range monitor because that is where I'll spend most of my time. Cost is not so much of an issue, i just want the best of both worlds, if it even exists.
Although you said cost is not an issue there seem to be a decent selection of monitors out there that would get you similar features, without wide gamut, for a lot less money. Monitors with that resolution, DisplayPort, pivoting, etc. are now widely available.
One last note: Minor problems have been observed with these monitors in OS X Mavericks. I think they started turning up in 10.9.2. It still performs the same but some things don't work right and it looks like Apple's fault:
OS X 10.9.2 Breaks Display Support with NEC Displays: Sleep, 90° Rotation Failure
Apparently all is needed is for Apple to fix it in the next release, whenever that is. A later post on that same blog indicates that a fix may be coming from Apple. Again, these problems do not stop the monitor from doing its job so if you want one you should still buy it.

32 bit per channel

Does the 32 bit per channel retain the sign if negative through processing, saving and then reading? It is advertized as floating point.
RONC

they are handled In the same way but in a linear version of the color space which makes a big difference. Search and learn about linear vs non - linear editing.
here's one link about it. http://mysite.verizon.net/spitzak/conversion/index.html
when reading the information in the above link have in mind that although the author talks about sRGB this is valid for all RGB color spaces which have non-linear gamma.

Confused about Color Management in CS5 (Photos appearing differently in all other programs)

I recently noticed this and it's been driving me crazy; when I view photos in Photoshop CS5 they appear significantly lighter/more washed out than when viewed in other programs like Zoombrowser, Digital Photo Professional or just in a regular Windows folder using Filmstrip mode (Windows XP). When opening the same photo in both CS5 and Zoombrowser and switching back and forth between the two windows the difference is very apparent...for example, one of the photos I compared was of a person in a black shirt -- in CS5 (lighter/washed out) the folds in the shirt were very obvious, but in Zoombrowser (darker, more contrast/saturation) the folds were nearly invisible and it looked like just solid black. Now, after messing around with the settings in both Photoshop and in Zoombrowser I've found a few ways to get the photos to look the same in the two programs; one way gives them both the lighter/more washed out appearance and another way gives them both the darker appearance with more contrast and saturation. My problem is that I'm not sure which view is accurate.
I use a NEC MultiSync LCD1990SXi monitor with SpectraView II calibration software and calibrate it every 2 weeks using these calibration settings (screenshot): http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/8826/settingsx.jpg
In the SpectraView II Software under Preferences there's an option that says "Set as Windows Color Management System Monitor Profile - Automatically selects and associates the generated ICC monitor profile with the Color Management System (CMS)." This option is checked. Also, when I open the Windows' Color Management window there's only one option displayed, which is "LCD1990SXi #######" (the ####### represents my monitor's serial number).
I assume the above settings are all correct so far, but I'm not sure about the rest.
Here are my current default Color Settings in CS5 (screenshot): http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/666/photoshopcolorsettings.jpg
Changing these settings around doesn't seem to make the photo appear much different. However, when I go to Edit -> Assign Profile, then click off of "Working RGB: sRGB IEC61966-2.1" and instead click Profile and select "LCD1990SXi ####### 2011-06-21 18-30 D65 2.20" from the drop-down menu, the picture becomes darker with more contrast and saturation and matches the picture in Zoombrowser. Also, if I select "Adobe RGB (1998)" from the drop-down menu it's very similar in terms of increased darkness and contrast but the saturation is higher than with the LCD1990SXi setting. Another way I've found to make the image equally dark with increased contrast and saturation is to go to View -> Proof Setup -> Custom and then click the drop-down menu next to "Device to Simulate" and select "LCD1990SXi ####### 2011-06-21 18-30 D65 2.20" again.
Alternatively, to make both images equally light and washed out I can go to Zoombrowser -> Tools -> Preferences and check the box next to "Color Management: Adjust colors of images using monitor profile." This makes the image in Zoombrowser appear just like it does in CS5 by default.
Like I said, I'm confused as to which setting is the accurate one (I'm new to Color Management in general so I apologize for my ignorance on the subject).
It would seem that assigning the LCD1990SXi profile in CS5 would be the correct choice in order to match the monitor calibration given the name of the profile but the "Adjust colors of images using monitor profile" option in Zoombrowser sounds like it would do the same thing as well. Also, I've read that Photoshop is a color managed software whereas Zoombrowser and Windows Picture and Fax Viewer are not which makes me think that maybe the lighter/washed out version seen in Photoshop is correct. So which version (light or dark) is the accurate one that I should use to view and edit my photos? Thanks in advance for any help or info.

Sorry for the late reply;
But before we go there or make any assumptions, it's important for
you to determine whether you're seeing consistent color in your
color-managed applications and only inconsistent color in those that are
not color-managed. For that you'll need to do a little research to see
if the applications in which you're seeing darker colors have
color-management capability (and whether it is enabled).
I opened the same picture in 7 different applications and found that the 6 of the 7 displayed the photo equally dark with equally high contrast when compared to the 7th application (CS5). The other 6 applications were Zoombrowser EX, Digital Photo Professional, Windows Picture and Fax Viewer, Quicktime PictureViewer, Microsoft Office Picture Manager and Firefox.
However, at least two of these programs offer color management preferences and, when used, display the photo (from what I can tell) exactly the same as Photoshop CS5's default settings. The two programs are two Canon programs: Zoombrowser EX and Digital Photo Professional. Here's the setting that needs to be selected in Zoombrowser in order to match up with CS5 (circled in red):
And here's the setting in Digital Photo Professional that needs to be selected in order to match up with CS5 (again, circled in red):
*Note: When the option above "Monitor Profile" is selected ("Use the OS settings") the image is displayed exactly the same as when the monitor profile is selected. It's only when sRGB is selected that it goes back to the default darker, more contrasty version.
So with the red-circled options selected, all three programs (CS5, ZB, DPP) display the images the same way; lighter and more washed out. What I'm still having trouble understanding is if that ligher, more washed out display is the accurate one or not...I've read several tutorials for all three programs which only make things more confusing. One of the tutorials says to always use sRGB if you want accurate results and *never* to use Monitor Profile and another says that, if you're using a calibrated monitor, you should always select Monitor Profile under the color management settings...so I'm still lost, unfortunately.
What I also don't understand is why, when the monitor profile is selected in CS5, the image is displayed in the dark and contrasty way that the other programs display it as by default but when the monitor profile is selected in Digitial Photo Professional it displays it in the lighter, more washed out way that CS5 displays it using CS5's default settings (sRGB). Why would selecting the monitor profile in DPP display the photo the same way as when sRGB is selected in Photoshop? And vice versa...why would selecting the monitor profile in Photoshop display the photo the same way as when sRGB is selected in DPP?
I feel like I'm missing something obvious here...which I probably am. Again, I'm very new to this stuff so pardon my ignorance on the topic.
By the way, I find that the way that the non-color managed programs (Windows Picture and Fax Viewer et al.) display the photos is more aesthetically pleasing to the eye than the duller, more washed out display that CS5 gives the photos, but ultimately what I want to see in these programs (especially PS5 where I'll be doing the editing) is the accurate representation of the actual photo itself...i.e. what it's supposed to look like and not a darker (or lighter) variant of it.
So just to reiterate my questions:
Why does selecting Monitor Profile under the color management settings in DPP give the same display results as the default sRGB profile in CS5 and vice versa? (CS5 with monitor profile selected having the same display results as DPP with the sRGB profile selected)
When using CS5 with it's default color management settings (sRGB), using DPP with the Monitor Profile selected, and using Zoombrowser EX with "Adjust color of images using monitor profile" selected this results in all three programs displaying the same lighter, washed-out images...is this lighter, more washed-out display of the images shown in these three programs the accurate one?
I noticed when opening an image in Firefox it had the same darker, contrasty look as the other non-color managed applications had. Assuming that the CS5 default settings are accurate, does this mean that if I edit a photo in CS5, save it, and upload it to the internet that other people who are viewing that image online will see it differently than how it's supposed to look (i.e. in a non-color-managed way?) If so, this would seem to indicate that they'd see a less-than-flattering version of the photo since if their browser naturally displays images as darker and more contrasty and I added more darkness and contrast to the image in CS5, they'd be seeing a version of the photo that's far too dark and probably wouldn't look very good. Is this something I have to worry about as well?
I apologize for the lengthy post; I do tend to be a bit OCD about these things...it's a habit I picked up once I realized I'd been improperly editing photos on an incorrectly calibrated monitor for years and all that time and effort had been spent editing photos in a certain way that looked good on my incorrectly calibrated monitor but looked like crap on everyone else's screen, so the length and detail of this post comes from a desire to not repeat similar mistakes by editing photos the wrong way all over again. Again, thanks in advance for all the help, it's greatly appreciated!

Is Lightroom sending sRGB to the printer driver?

Hello,
I've been trying to print something on a color laser printer with Lightroom. Unfortunately, Lightroom doesn't seem to support the profile of the printer, maybe it's a CMYK profile, and so I had to use the option "Profile: managed by printer" in Lightrooms print module.
In order to set up the printer driver correctly and let him handle the color management, I'd like to know what Lightrooms sends to the printer driver when the option "managed by printer" is set (and when draft mode is off!)
Thanks in advance

Jeff Schewe - 12:08am Jan 1, 08 PST (#2 of 8)
Version 1.0 sent sRGB
Uh, no...since the beta process, when not using draft mode, Lightroom ALWAYS sent ProProto RGB. Draft mode will send either sRGB or Adobe RGB depending on the settings for the previews.
Since the OP is printing to a laser printer as opposed to a photo printer, the best bet would be to print using draft mode anyway.
Jeff,
You may be right and I am sure you know more about this than I do, but in 1.0 I could print contact sheets to my laser printer with no problems with "managed by printer" selected and draft mode off. Since 1.1 I have not been able to get acceptable results regardless of whether I choose draft mode or not and regardless of the settings in the export module. I would love to solve this as it is the number 1 issue I have with Lightroom.
Gordon

I have a problem with color prints from photoshop elements 12. The pictures are too light and with strange colors. I have a Canon pixma mg615I0 printer and use mac os X yosemite. The pictures are taken with a coanon eos 550d in the color space sRGB. I hav

Hi
I have a problem with color prints from photoshop elements 12. The pictures are too light and with strange colors. I have a Canon pixma mg615I0 printer and use mac os X yosemite. The pictures are taken with a coanon eos 550d in the color space sRGB. I have followed adobes recommendations and have tried both letting the printer respektive photoshop manage the colors. But nothing works. I see that there are different opinions about which is best to do so I tried both. I have the latest printer driver installed. Can anyone help me with this?

Do the following:
Print a test page from the printer. Perhaps the print head needs cleaning via its maintenance facility.
Let the printer manage colors, not PSE
Calibrate the monitor

Why does Photoshop display colors differently from the other applications even in sRGB mode ?

Hello all !
Here is my problem :
Photoshop is set to use sRGB workspace (in edit/colors.../workspace/RVB).
If I understand correctly this is how all native windows applications work.
This means Photoshop and the other applications should display the same colors on a file with a sRGB profile.
Now this is the case until I calibrate my monitor.
When I do, Photoshop colors become different from the other applications (irfanview, explorer, browsers...).
The only way I found to let everything display the same colors is to set Photoshop to use Proofing/RVB Monitor.
What upsets me even more is that Photoshop colors look "better" to me (dark grays seem to dark to me in the other applications.)
I have read that this is because Photoshop takes the new profile into account and others applications do not. But I don't think this is relevant here because everything is in sRGB so the only profile is my monitor's and I think calibration is handled globally by windows : everything (including browsers, explorer, and Photoshop) changes color if I choose to apply the monitor's profile or not with windows color management tool ("use my parameters for this device").
Here is my system configuration :
- Photoshop CS4 (11.0.2)
- Windows 7 64 bits
- HP ZR2440W and DELL 2209WA (these are not wide gamut screens)
I have spent two days trying to figure the logics behind this and really am upset. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Don't hesitate to ask me if there is something that is unclear or some information I forgot to mention.
Thanks in advance,
Yannick

That sounds like an invitation to continue to talk about the issue. Fair enough.
I'm not sure where you're getting "insecurity"... I am just trying to help you help others more effectively.
I invite you to re-read just the first sentence of what you wrote very carefully, putting yourself in the shoes of someone struggling with both the terminology and the concepts:
Photoshop (CMS) reads an embedded ICC profile and CONVERTS it to the custom monitor profile for a theoretical 'true color' display
Think about what "Photoshop (CMS)" might mean to a person who doesn't know the acronym might stand for "Color Management System" (which is I assume what you meant). Adobe themselves don't call it "CMS", they use the acronym "CMM" (Color Management Module). The term "CMS" is used in the computer industry for about a dozen different things.
While a color profile might have been embedded in an image file before it was opened by Photoshop, Photoshop works on documents. A profile is not "embedded" in a document, it is maintained by Photoshop with the document and describes the color values in the document. If Photoshop opens a document without an embedded profile, depending on settings and user choices it might assign a profile or it might even operate on the document without color-management. Oversimplification doesn't help people when they're trying to learn new things unless it's described as such, for example, "This is a bit of an oversimplification..." or "Generally speaking..."
Not every monitor profile is a "custom monitor profile". Quite often a standard profile (e.g., sRGB IEC61966-2.1) is associated with a monitor by the operating system as a default, or a factory profile is installed by a driver package or system update. Your use of the term "custom" is a bit ambiguous and could be read as implying the creation of a profile using a calibration and profiling device specific to the particular monitor.
Photoshop's color management code does not convert an embedded ICC profile at all (read carefully what you wrote). As I said, it transforms color values. That was the key error in your description that prompted me to comment.
If ever there is a time to pick words carefully, it's in a color-management discussion.
-Noel

Colors off in Preview when viewing JPG's with sRGB profiles

I have a 30" Dell monitor and my display preferences are set to use the calibrated profile for it. When I view JPGs images in any color managed application such as Preview the colors are horribly off. They are kind of dull, unsaturated, pale. JPG's that don't have sRGB profiles show up fine.
I can fix the problem in photoshop by opening the image and then doing a save for web which strips the profile information off of the jpg.
If I use sRGB as my monitor's profile colors are consistent across all applications but the problem is the colors are really bad. Extremely over contrasty and very dark.
What's going on with my color profiles?

Hi topmodelphotography ..
If you're keen about running the right profiles - please don't mess up the way you do. The sRGB profile that you're using is showing a narrower color space (value 0-16 of blacks are out). The sRGB profile is mainly used for consumer monitors in the cheap end where contrast conditions are worse that expensive and professional displays to present contents in a similar way across manufacturers. If you should use any predefined color profile, please use Adobe (1998) profiling.
best practive is calibrating your monitor with a good calibrator and use these profiles.
In System Preferences you should set up the calibrated profile and the same goes for all Adobe apps under Color Settings.
Useful reading concerning Color Profiles:
http://kb.adobe.com/selfservice/viewContent.do?externalId=321382&sliceId=1
Your issue with Preview is most likely due to erroneous setup in System Settings. otherwise try and disable Dithering in Preview.
And don't use Save for Web if you intend to keep at least a minor part of your colors in your images. Use TIFF's where possible (without 'upgrading' images from compressed formats such as JPEG's, GIF's, etc.)
useful reading about Image compression:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_compression
Hope this answers some of you questions.

Best way to configure Photoshop workflow settings when source photos are shot in AdobeRGB, edited using a wide gamut display, and output to sRGB?

Being able to quickly produce finished photos is of importance with the majority of my photography work. Therefore I shoot, process, and deliver JPEG files. For this time sensitive workflow there is no benefit to my clients by my shooting RAW. I do want to be able to accommodate any possible future uses of the photos, so I shoot using the Adobe RGB color space. The output for my clients are JPEG images for use on the Web, therefore sRGB. I currently used a wide gamut display (NEC PA302W) with a 24-bit graphics card. (I plan on upgrading to a 30-bit card sometime in the future.)
I've noticed that in Internet Explorer the reds in my finished photos are overly intense on my display. My photos look fine in other web browsers on my display. This situation has me concerned as I do not know exactly why it is happening since my photos have the sRBG color profile embedded and IE supports embedded color profiles. If anything, I would think the reds would be overly intense in other applications that do not support embedded color profiles.
Please let me know if my workflow can be improved, outside of shooting RAW and using a 30-bit display:
Shoot JPEG photos in Adobe RBG color space
Edit photos in Photoshop using wide gamut display, 24-bit
Color Settings: Monitor Color (Monitor RGB - PA302W, calibrated)
Save for Web, JPEG, Embed Color Profile, Convert to sRGB
While working in Photoshop the reds appear fine. When saving for the Web and previewing 'Monitor Color' the reds are intense, when previewing 'Internet Standard RGB (No Color Management)' the reds appear fine. The final saved images look fine with the exception of when displayed in IE, which supports embedded color profiles- Color Management.

You're rapidly making a mess out of this. Stop, sit back, and stop thinking there's a "problem" to "fix". There isn't - you just need to use software that is color managed. That disqualifies IE right off. Stop using it, throw it away. It's useless with wide gamut displays. Use Firefox, which has proper color management.
OK. Save For Web in sRGB, embed profile. So far so good. But:
Don't ! set your working space to Monitor Color!. That turns off display color management which is the very last thing you want with a wide gamut monitor. You could sort of get away with that with a standard gamut monitor, because it's not all that different from sRGB anyway. So you wouldn't notice the difference (but it's there). The fact that your Adobe RGB files look right in Photoshop is purely coincidental. Any other profile will look wrong.
With a wide gamut display you absolutely and unconditionally need a fully color managed pipeline. That means 1. an embedded document profile, 2. a valid display profile (Spectraview or other calibrator), and 3. an application that reads both profiles and does the conversion from one to the other as the image is sent to the display.
See, it's not just the document profile. That's half of it. The other half is the display profile. IE doesn't use the display profile, instead substituting sRGB. And that's very wrong with that monitor. Firefox is fully color managed if there is an embedded document profile. But it can be configured to color manage even if the image is untagged (and a lot of material on the web is untagged). It does this by assigning sRGB to the image.
To configure this - and you really need that with a wide gamut monitor - type "about:config" without the quotes in the address bar and hit reload. Scroll down to gfx.color_management.mode, and change it from 2 to 1. Relaunch. All web material will now appear correctly regardless.

HELP with sRGB in Photoshop Color Management Winows Vista

Greetings beautiful Windows people!
I am stumped with a Windows Vista problem — it is not displaying sRGB properly.
I posted bigger files here if this is easier to follow
http://www.gballard.net/windows_srgb/
But here goes:
First, my main question is HOW Windows Vista deals with sRGB because I am seeing inconsistant sRGB color on a client's workflow.
The first clue is:
How Photoshop is displaying Tagged sRGB on the two machines:
The original sRGB tagged file opens as above on my Mac.
Note: In the lower screen shots, Firefox has color-management enabled — and Photoshop's Working RGB is set to sRGB (it is using the sRGB embedded profile).
In the above Windows screenshot — Photoshop and Firefox look yellow — Explorer displays TAGGED sRGB correct — FireFox incorrectly matches Photoshop.
In the above Windows screenshot — Photoshop looks yellow — Explorer 8 and Firefox display UNTAGGED sRGB correct.
BECAUSE THIS IS CONTRARY TO THE THEORY, I suspected a bad profile so we loaded sRGB as the Monitor profile in the Windows Color Management setting.
Setting Windows Vista> Control Panel> Color Management: to sRGB fixed the problem (above, Photoshop is displaying the file correctly now, and sRGB is behaving as expected in both managed and unmanaged Web browsers).
However, I am clueless about two things:
Is Vista's "Color Management" Control Panel setting its Monitor RGB, or
Is Vista's "Color Management" Control Panel setting a DEFAULT RGB for the system?
I suspect the client has a bad hardware puck and/or buggy profiling package that needs an update because it appears to be even causing Photoshop to display sRGB improperly using the custom profile (and this is happening on eight of the client's Windows boxes).
He is using a glossy screen on the laptop I saw if his package can't handle it).
Can someone please clue me here as to what's going on (and how Vista should be set up to display sRGB consistantly in Photoshop and WEB BROWSERS)?

Thank you Chris,
When I did windows update I must have checked to download new display drivers I'm using (Dell with Dell Screens). It was loaded into the color settings as a profile, I hit delete and now all is well.
-Patrick

About SRGB

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