BT Vision missold - disgraceful!

On 24/08/11 I called BT on the recommendation of a friend who lives elsewhere in the country to ask about their TV, phone and broadband packages. We previously used a similar package from Virgin Media.  Virgin Media could not match the price of BT's package (once Sky Sports had been added), so having spoken to BT, I decided to switch and signed up to the BT Vision, BT Infinity Broadband and Unlimited Calls package with Sky Sports 1.
I was on the phone to the BT employee for over an hour while he sorted this out and referred to it as a 'complex order'.  I couldn't see what was so complex about it, but he sounded new to the job so I remained patient as he went through the process.  At no stage during the conversation did the BT employee tell me that being able to use BT Vision was reliant on having an aerial at my house with which to receive Freeview channnels.  I told him that we were previously with Virgin but at no point did he explain the difference between cable and BT Vision as an aerial/freeview based service.  We do not have an aerial at our house.   I recall specifically asking him whether our house was likely to already have everything we need in order to use the service and that his reply was yes, and that if it didn't, the engineer who visits would install a BT line or a socket, as this was the only thing likely to pose a problem.  He told me that the engineer would install everything, show me how it works and make sure I was completely happy before he left.  I believed that everything would be fine because why would BT sell you a new service that they weren't sure you could use - right?!
On 31/08 the hardware arrived: Vision box, Hub, remote etc.  On 02/09 I took the day off work to be home for the engineer. The engineer arrived and drilled a hole, installed a wire to move an old socket that the previous people in our house had used in another room and set up the broadband and phone line.  He said that he does not get involved with the BT Vision part though, that if I wanted help with that, I'd have to arrange for a separate engineer to come out.
I set about installing the BT Vision myself. Following the instructions and obviously stumbling at the first because I had no aerial cable to attach to the Vision box as per the diagrams.  Without the aerial, I can watch iPlayer and some pay perview programmes/films and not a lot else - hardly value for money.  The Sky Sports card also does not seem to work, but I'm unsure as to whether this is down to the lack of aerial problem.  I spent all day yesterday fiddling with this and by the time I was finished, customer services was shut (and I was furious, so just as well I couldn't call then!).  
I have to say that the BT Infinity part of the package is wonderful and I would like to keep this and the phone line.
I have been quoted nearly £200 for the installation of an aerial on my roof and £45 for the addition of a socket for the wiring to enter the house in the right place.  That's an additional £250 to use BT Vision.  I hadn't bargained for this, wasn't informed of this at the point of sale and I certainly cannot afford it!  On closer inspection on the website/ help pages, BT have a preferred partner for installations of aerials - I bet they do - what a nice little earner!
Today, 03/09, I called BT. They were very helpful and said that if the young man I spoke to when I was signing up didn't do a freeview check with me, i.e. talk about the channels we'd get and mention the aerial, then we have been missold and that this is serious, especially considering that this is one of BT's premium products.  BT are handing it on to an offline team who will listen to the call I made on 24/08 and check.  If they find that he hasn't done what he should have done, then they will cancel the Vision service, take back the box and not charge us for any of it, while keeping the BT Infinity and phone line intact. BT have said that they will contact me within 5 working days and let me know.  
I am SURE that the salesaman did NOT make it CLEAR that I would need an aerial to access the service.  If he had mentioned the aerial, I would have gone away to check before signing up, as we have never used an aerial since we have been in this property.  The salesman made me feel that the engineer would solve any problems but when he arrived he wouldn't even touch the Vision box!  Until yesterday I didn't even understand that BT Vision is basically just Freeview with iPlayer and pay per view movies.  BT obviously need to make sure this is crystal clear in all conversations and advertising. 
Before I knew that all this would be such a headache I cancelled my Virgin Media services and they have already been round to take back their set top box etc. - I'll also have the problems of restarting a cancelled service with them if BT manage to resolve the above!  I wish I'd never even heard of BT!
I will let you know how it goes....

Homework includes listening to the people who are selling the service!  We're not talking about some 'fly by the night' cowboy outfit here, and BT have a (moral) responsibility to ensure that they're not selling a service that the consumer can't access. 
I can remember my own call when I signed up to Vision, and they asked about my reception for Freeview, so BT's own procedures were followed, and I have no complaints despite not being able to receive all 6 mux's.
You only have to read this forum to understand that there are many questions about what Vision does and doesn't provide (HD content is a perfect example), the least you can expect from BT's own employee's is a basic explanation.
Not everyone is this world is technically savvy and what seems obvious to you and me may not be obvious to others. It seems to me from the original post that BT's own procedures weren't followed and so the OP (who's happy to keep the BB and phone - so isn't on some sort of anti BT crusade) should be allowed to drop Vision at no charge to themselves.
For the avoidance of doubt I have no complaints about the level of service I have had from BT
......but I'm not an 'expert'....yet!

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    Connect your ZEN to a "USB-PORT" (not to a "hub")?A USB-PORT is located on your computer (the box). A "Hub" is a little box connected to one USB-PORTS and it "splits" this port into several USB-Connectors... ideally useful for "devices" that do not required lost of information or current (i.e. mouse, drawing table, keyboard, etc). Devices that required a continuous or heavy amounts of information (i.e. External Hard Dri'ves, Camcorders, Webcams sometimes, required an individual USB-PORT)<?Two things here:?- This link is for the original messagehttp://forums.creative.com/creativel...essage.id=7293?[size="+2"][color="#ff0000"]2- Happy Conclusion installing the ZEN Vision M (30 Gig)<i>(I am writing this for several reasons. Mainly, because it was a difficult installation and I wanted to summarize the 200 or 300 steps/actions I did that led me to solve the problem successfully. I always do this when I have a difficult installation and then I save it for the next time I need it (i.e. changing computers). I certainly don?t want to waste all that effort. One thing I learned about ?technology? is hard to learn it but it can be forgotten so easily, if you don?t take notes.)</i>
    <p align="center">---------------------------------------
    [size="+2"][color="#ff3300">What was causing the problem?
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    [size="+2"][color="#ff3300">So how did?everything go?from ?so bad? to ?so wonderful?? <i>I don?t really know exactly!</i>
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    ?2 - As I read and read, things began to come back to my brain. Especially a post reply that gave me the hint (Reformatting the dri've in the Zen) would finally let me ?transfer? my stuff to the Zen
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    [size="+2"][color="#ff3300">Let me recap I what happened:
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    ?3- I also downloaded the latest updates from Creative.com (downloads/upgrades). I downloaded the ?firmware? (the ?upgrade,? <i>which is the OS=Operating System for the ZEN. Just like ?Windows? is to the PC)</i> and other ?patches? for?the ?creative media source 5? and ?Zencast organizer? (3 updates). I am sure this upgrades helped some, as well.
    ?4- After trying so many times, I was finally able to open the ?Zen Media Explorer? (Icon looks like a picture of the Zen). When this opens, it shows you everything inside the Zen just like in the ?explorer? (nice). That meant I had connectivity! (good).
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    ?6- Then a nice lady?who responded to my first post, told me she had basically the same problems and the solution was to ?Clean and re-format? the ?Disk dri've?in the ZEN. She said that once she?did that, everything would sort of fall into place? and she was right!
    ?7- I unplugged the ZEN from the PC and read somewhere how ?to clean, reformat, upgrade or replace the ?firmware,? Not sure still, but it'ss something like ?resetting (with a clip) the Zen and holding the ?power? slide in the ON position? something like that, and that brings a special screen with 4 choices:
    Clean<
    Reformat dri've (erases everything!), <
    Replace firmware (careful here!), <
    Reboot. <
    Then it'ss pretty easy?to do a lot of ?damage? in a few seconds!... ([color="#ff3300">careful here if you are not used to the sensitivity of the "touch-pad")In my case I did not care since I had not put anything there yet. I erased EVERYTHING!... (not a good thing). I should have been more careful and simply use option 2 (reformat the dri've). Chances are this would have been enough to transfer songs to the ZEN. But since I get crazy when doing stuff like this, I went ahead a cleaned everything.
    ?8- Then I realized I had erased the ?firmware. As you already know this is the ?heart? of the Zen. (like Windows to the PC). Finally I went to Creative.com/downloads and downloaded it (the full version). But if you remember in #3, I had also downloaded the ?firmware? upgrade as well. The reason this is significant, is, that when I finally recovered ?connectivity? to the ZEN, I? tried both files, but the one that ZEN accepted was the upgrade! (I found this interesting? since I would have thought the full version would have been the correct choice? see?... little things you learn.
    ?9- As I already gave you a hint in #8, once I had the ?firmware? ready to install, the system kept telling me it could NOT see the ZEN. I connected and disconnected the USB cable several times? rebooted the pc? this helps sometimes, but nothing!... FINALLY, I read somewhere, I should go to the ?device manager? and check what was going on.. ? EUREKA ? indeed I found the ZEN with a ?Yellow mark? on the side, which always means trouble. Basically, I used the ?uninstall? option (based of the principle that simply ?un-installing and installing back something? sometimes this works. In other words, the ZEN was ?stucked. So when I ?removed? It from the ?Device Manager? list (I don?t recall if I rebooted here? but it never hurts!), then all of the sudden? a little icon in Windows (on the small tray=bottom right corner (with the clock and Date),? acknowledged?a new deviced had been connected to Windows. (connectivity back again! Yeahhh).
    ?0- Now that had ?connectivity? (Big step), I could try installing the ?firmware. And as I already explained, the ?upgrade? was the one that ZEN took. As soon as you clicked on the file, a box opened and asked if you wanted to install the ?firmware. I said yes and voila!... The Zen started accepting it's and when it ended, just like a PC, the ZEN rebooted itself and I was able to see the familiar interface (the same folders as before) but not contents at all? empty!
    ?- At this?point?I opened the ?Creative Media Source organizer,? went to my ?playlist? and from there, just click and drag some songs and dropped them on top of the Zen Icon (just like dropping files in a folder). And yes, the files were finally ?transferred? to the ZEN. Unplugged the USB cable from the Zen (or the Zen does not play anything). The songs were there and I was FINALLY able to listen to them from the ZEN!... Wonderful. Oh yes, using the same technique (drag and drop), I put a wmv video and was able to watch it as well... Now I know why people rave about the little screen... nice!
    ?2- In the mean time, without noticing? Just like the nice lady?from the post said, everything seemed to have fallen into place!
    ?In Summary: The applications ( the creative programs=icons)?were opening normally and quickly now, and many of the errors I got before when clicking on certain things, disappeared. I am sure I will still find some problems here and there, but basically the thing works now the way it is supposed to.
    ?Just a matter of clicking, dragging and dropping items?into the Zen?.yes, that simple!
    ?Good luck!
    [url="http://forums.creative.com/creativelabs/board/message?board.id=dap&message.id=7293">[/url]
    Message Edited by em2253 on 2-26-2006:39 AM
    Message Edited by em2253 on 2-3-20060:32 AM
    Message Edited by em2253 on 2-3-200602:26 PM
    Message Edited by em2253 on 0-02-200702:3 AM

    [url="http://web6.streamhoster.com/em2253/ZEN/ZenDeviceManager.wmv]See Movie[/url]?Hi, take a look at the movie... hopefully I answer to your question is there. [b]Let me know if you can NOT see it... [/b]and I will send you a picture. [color="#ff0000"]and if you can see the movie, give me feedback on it. Did it look ok in your computer? (it changes with all computers depending on your setting and player!). [color="#ff0000"]Was the sound ok?I almost wish I had not titled this post as "Happy Conclusion." It was happy but only a day or two... then I started having other problems... unbelievable. So, If I gave the wrong impression, sorry!

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