LR2: export jpg sRGB vs. print to jpeg sRGB - Same colors in MS explorer preview?

Hello !
Im using LR2 and do have problems understanding why "printing" to jpeg and exporting to jpeg give different results (colorwise) in the following case:
The first picture was exported using "jpeg" file format and "sRGB" color space.
The second picture was "printed" to jpeg using "sRGB" profile and rendering intend etiher "perceptual" or "relative" (doesn't matter).
I was just wondering, why in explorer preview(MS Windows XP sp3 with a calibrated monitor) colors of both pictures look different. The "printed" jpeg does have less red in it.
shouldn't the look the same in this case?
Did I miss something here?
Any hints appreciated.
Thank you very much
Sokrates

Hello,
thanks for pointing me to the related threads.
Indeed the results of the LR2 functions "print to jpeg" and "slideshow to jpeg" are dependent of the current monitor profile being used.
Here are my expamples:
http://www.tiga-online.de/downloads/comparison.jpg
if you have a closer look, it becomes more obvious:
upper left picture:
http://www.tiga-online.de/downloads/P5248984_print_sRGB_with_sRGB_monitor_profile.jpg
upper right picture (which shows different color):
http://www.tiga-online.de/downloads/P5248984_print_sRGB_with_sypder_profile.jpg
lower left picture:
http://www.tiga-online.de/downloads/P5248984_export_sRGB_with_sypder_profile.jpg
lower right picture:
http://www.tiga-online.de/downloads/P5248984_export_sRGB_with_sRGB_monitor_profile.jpg
Thanks again
Sokrates

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LR2 and PS Eelements8 show different RGB for the same color - Please, HELP

LR2, Elements 8, Color Chart 24 (CC24),
Please help. I may need to reset LR2 to factory default or to something else.
For the following RAW adjustments the tone curve set to Linear, Contrast and Brightness to 0
I have photographed a CC24 in RAW. Opened image in Elements 8 and adjusted Exposure to 243 for the White patch #19
Then with with WB tool clicked on the 50% Gray and then readjusted exposure for the CC24 listed 243 for #19.
Now all Gray patches #19 through #24 as listed in the table or very close R=G=B (243, 200, 160, 122, 85, 52)
The RGB numbers for Red Patch #15 are R=169, G=58, B=63
The CC24 listed RGB for Red patch #15 are R=175, G=54, B=60
Also saved the adjusted image as JPG
Then opened the image in LR2 and adjusted exposure and WB as described above for Elements 8.
The Gray patches #19 through #24 show RGB numbers as listed in the table or very close.
The RGB numbers for the Red patch #15 are R=138, G=84, B=64.
However the CC24 RGB for Red patch #15 are R=175, G=54, B=60
Exported the image as JPG
Then opened the two saved JPG images in Elements. these two images read almost identical RGB numbers for each patch.
How can I fix LR2 RGB reading. Recently I have saved as defaults the tone curve set to Linear, Contrast and Brightness to 0 and probably did it wrong. My be I need to reset LR2 to the factory defaults to restore its correct reading or something else.
Please help.
Leonid

Q1. Is that means that when LR2 Exported RAW to JPG the correct numbers resulted from conversion?
You should be careful with the term RGB numbers. Such numbers are only useful when you know the working space. For example, sRGB, adobeRGB, prophotoRGB, melissaRGB, etc. The numbers I calculated are simply the reference numbers (find them here: http://www.brucelindbloom.com/index.html?ColorCheckerRGB.html ). I recalculated the values in the display space used in Lightroom from Bruce Lindbloom's values in normal prophotoRGB which is a simple arithmetic excercise. When Lightroom exports a jpeg, you can set the color space in the export panel and it will do the conversion for you meaning that it will translate between its internal colorspace and the desired export color space. In an external program, you will usually be working in sRGB, adobeRGB, or prophotoRGB, which are the three main spaces that Lightroom exports to. As you can see from Bruce's tables in the link above the RGB values for these patches in all these spaces are different.
For example RGB for MacBeth CC24 Red patch (#15) was shown as 203, 0, 0 and x-rite RGB is 174, 54, 60.
They are actually the exact same chart. As I say above the values are meaningless if you don't know the colorspace. The first RGB triplet you quote makes no sense at all. It does not correspond to any colorspace listed for the MacBeth chart. The zeros indicate that the color is far outside of the gamut of the used color space, so the value is basically useless. The second is sort of close to the sRGB value.
Q.2 Would it mean that your shown table should not be applied to (used with) x-rite CC24 but to MacBeth only?
They should be pretty good for both as the chart is supposed to be the same.
Q3. Have you created your posted LR table or it was provided by Adobe?
I created it myself. Since you have a colorchecker, you should look into creating a camera profile using it. This can be done with X-rite's excellent passport utility (free download from their website), or with Adobe's free DNG profile Editor. Simply shoot a chart in the right light conditions and run the raw/dng file through this utility and a profile is created that will allow you to get very good color rendering from your camera if you shoot raw.

Export vs. print to jpeg

I have prepared a print file for HP Photo Creations using export and another one usint print to jpeg. When I compare them they seem identical. Is one approach better than the the other?

The export gives you a little more options (like sizing) than print to JPEG, whereas print to JPEG has the advantage of prepared layouts (like several images per page). In terms of image quality, they're the same as long as you use the same options on both sides (like color space, quality, PPI).
Beat

Image appearance in Lightroom does not match exported .jpg

First time user of Lightroom, so be gentle.
I edit a RAW file in Lightroom and get it looking good, but when I export to jpg I run into a problem where the photo takes on a strong rosy hue.
This image shows the problem:
http://www.vaughnsphotoart.com/miscimg/colordifference.jpg
I took a screenshot of Lightroom, and superimposed the jpg output next to it.
I have been using RawShooter and have had no problems with the exported files matching the in-program image. I've had pretty good luck getting on-screen views to match my prints. So I'm a little baffled here at what to do. I see others are running into this as well (see http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx/.3bc34927/2 ) so a response might help many.
Am I correct to guess this has something to do with the Adobe ProPhoto color space?
What steps should I take to get my in-program image appearance match the exported version? I suspect I am missing a calibration process to get my color spaces to match, but I don't know how to affect the one Lightroom uses. Can anyone give some straightforward advice on what to do here?

I had exactly the same experience as Vaughn and David. I tried to do some tests of my own:
1. Exported a RAW image from LR as JPG, sRGB color space
2. Exported the exact same image as JPG specifying Adobe RGB
3. Exported the exact same image as TIFF (8bit, LZW compression), sRGB color
4. Exported the exact same image as TFF (8bit, LZW compression), Adobe RGB color space
The resulting images can be seen in the following web album:
http://picasaweb.google.com/Chris.Diewald/TestExportsFromAdobeLightroom.
(Most web browsers still do not care about embedded color space tags, but it appears that the images on the web page do not have a color-space tag anymore ! Still, they demonstrate what I see in other software on my screen.)
5. I opened these 4 images in Photoshop CS2, working space Adobe RGB (!), but specifically using the embedded profile (in the case of of sRGB exports).
Result: All 4 images - whether jpeg or TIFF, sRGB or Adobe RGB - look identical. And they are all identical to the likeness seen in LR!
6. I opened the sRGB images (jpg and TIFF) in Photoshop, but this time without preserving the embedded sRGB profile ("discard the embedded profile, don't color-manage"):
Result: The two sRGB images show a distinctive shift towards red and are a tad brighter. This was expected in a way.
7. I opened these 4 images in Microsoft Fax and Picture Viewer:
Result: All 4 images, whether TIFF or JPG, whether sRGB was embedded or Adobe RGB, are displayed identically, but *different* from what is seen in LR - more red and a bit brighter. Just like in Photoshop when the embedded sRGB profile was ignored.
8. Out of curiosity, I opened the 4 images in Picasa 2.5 (so popular with amateurs, so nice and so blindingly fast with huge masses of images. No comment on LR here...).
Result: Whether JPG or TIFF, the sRGB image comes out as redder and brighter, the AdobeRGB image exactly as viewed in LR!
9. Last Test: I opened the 4 images in Paintshop Pro 9.01
Result: same as those reported for Picasa. sRGB is not as seen in LR!
What does that suggest? I am not a color-space expert, so I leave that to those who know. But I am worrying whether LR really does what it says when I export?
Chris

Print to JPEG problem, color management

I tried the print module option "Prin to JPEG File". I have compared the result with Photoshop CS3: the colors appear more muted with LR2 than with PSCS3. The color management parameters are the same in both programs:
Profile: sRGB
Rendering intent: Relative
Have you experienced the same problem?
Thank you.

I got the same problem.
From the tests I've done, the "print to jpeg" function produces a file in the display profile, whatever profile it is tagged.
LR2.4 WinXPSP2, and it has been replicated by another user on LR2.5 with vista64b (link in french). Didn't try with LR3beta yet, but will soon.
1) export a file as sRGB to make a reference, which will be called 'the export'.
2) set it as a full page in the print module, and 'print' as jpeg with the sRGB profile : when opened in PS besides the export, it is quite different, and to restore colors you have to assign the display profile to it (not convert).
3) another 'print as jpeg' of this file with another color space (AdobeRGB eg) is similar to 2 in non-color-managed apps (say IrfanView, that means that RGB numbers are the same) and consequently different in PS : again, you have to assign the display profile to make it look like the export.
My personal conclusion : the print to jpeg exports files with RGB numbers relative to the display profile, tagged with the profile the user asked for.
Can anyone replicate this, on the Mac side maybe?
I'd think it's worth a bug report?

Problems with exporting .jpg file in Indesign CS3

Hello! I've used Indesign to create a memory book I would like to now place in another program to have printed (blurb is the company I'm using). Now that I have created the spreads I need to export each page individually as .jpg files, so that I can place them in to this other program to have them printed. (The program does not read .pdf files...they have to be .jpg). I exported each page and noticed that about 20 out of 90 have pages that have black bars over some of the pictures. I'm not sure how to remedy this problem and have tried changing some settings but unsuccessfully so. I've also had problems with Indesign crashing when I've tried to export the entire book as a .pdf. Thanks for the help!

I think I've seen that reported before, but don't remember if an answer was found.
HOWEVER, InDesign's jpeg export leave a lot to be desired under any circumstances, and the best method is to export a good PDF (Use one of the presets intended for printed output) then open that in Photoshop using appropriate settings (if you have body copy sized type, I'd recommend using 600 ppi to keep it realtively crisp, but the printer will probably complain about the size of the file) then save as a high quality jpeg in whichever color profile is recommended by the printer.
I know you said you had some trouble exporting the whole book as PDF, but maybe we can solve that if you give some more details.
Peter

Digital photo professional - export JPG from RAW

Hello!
i have a problem with program Digital photo professional, when i want export images from RAW format to JPG.
The problem is, that quality of image is much more worse, then in RAW format in DPP. JPG looks blurred and fuzzy.
IMAGE LINK:
Please check image, on the left side is print screen from RAW in DPP, on the right is exported JPG from DPP.
I want export JPG with the same quality as i see in RAW
Is there anybody to help me?
Thanks a lot.
Vit

1. open *.CR2 (raw file) in DPP
2.file/convert and save
3.type of file - EXif JPEG (JPG, JPEG)
4.image quality 10
5.output resolution 350dpi
6.check - embed icc profile in image
There are not another settings, so i dont know, why has exported JPG so bad quality...
When i open *.CR2 file in PS5, i see the same bad quality as exported JPG from DPP, but i read, that PS5, cannot
open CR2 file in best quality, because PS5 doesnt have all function, that have DPP.
I tested it on two PC, so problem is not only on my PC...
Thanks.

Exporting from Aperture, RAW+edits or JPEGs?

Forgive me if this is a basic question for seasoned users but I am new to Aperture (just coming to the end of a trial period).
I shoot in RAW format but have recently also included a JPEG medium sized version.
I have imported both versions into Aperture 3 and have chosen the raw version as the one to be viewed.
I would like to export the raw versions, as adjusted, into high quality large size file JPEGs which I can then burn to disk to share.
I can see how I export the master (with no ability to change the format) or the JPEG as it is (or at even a lower resolution). How do I get large size JPEGS from the raw version?
I have looked a little while for the answer - if it does happen to be covered elsewhere and I have not spotted it, please go easy on me.

Welcome to Apple Discussions!
In your camera, are you shooting RAW+JPEG, i.e. the JPEG is imbedded within a single file that includes the RAW image? This is an option for example on Canon cameras. When you Import form your camera, there are several options in the Import pane on the right side of Aperture’s window. You can select RAW+JPEG and use the RAW as Master or use the JPEG as Master. You should always select RAW as Master as you are limiting your control over the images if you work with JPEGs as Master. The JPEGs you import with those RAW files are not wasted however as Aperture will use them when present to generate Previews. Previews, when used, are what Aperture displays in the Viewer mode; Thumbnails are smaller than Previews and are displayed in the Browser mode.
You mentioned you are making adjustments to the Masters. I assume those Masters are your RAW files. So the images that are based on your adjusted Masters are called Versions. When you export, you can still Export Masters but those files will not include your adjustments. Typically you’ll want to Export Versions so the images you export include your adjustments.
Now to maximize the quality of the exported images, you can use the Aperture -> Presets -> Image Export to define how you want the images exported. You can Export your RAW adjusted images as JPEGs, TIFFs, PSDs, etc. So let’s say you choose JPEGs as the output format for your exported files.
When you execute the Aperture -> Presets -> Image Export or Files -> Export command, you’ll see a similar dialog in terms of selecting the image format and other items. It sounds like you want to use the JPEG format, original size, with high quality (use 10 or 12 for the image quality setting).
Are you exporting to be able to view on the Web (or any screen) or to print? If the goal is just to view, then you can select a DPI (dots per inch or PPI, pixels per inch) such as 72 or 100 or whatever matches your screen. If you are sending it to other people, you may likely select 72 as that’s the old screen default density. If you are planning on printing from the exported files, then you’ll want to select at least 300 dpi in the export panel.
As for colour profile, you can use the default sRGB as that will be commonly available for most users or make another selection as you wish. Your camera likely defaults to using sRGB colour space, but you can change that in some cameras to something like Adobe RGB 1998 if you have that option.
That should get you started. To summarize, define the settings you want in the Presets and I hope you have a better understanding of what Aperture does when you import your RAW+JPEG files and export Versions.

Print to JPEG File

For enlargements to be sent to a photo lab, I mostly use the option "Print to JPEG file" because this alows me the have wider borders than the photo lab's own, small borders. However, exporting to a JPEG file requires that a name be entered each and every time. It would be a very welcome feature for LR to autocomplete the photo's existing name, similar to what is done when "exporting" to JPG. It would certainly make my workflow easier and quicker.

What do you mean by lower quality? If I export at the same quality setting and scale to the same pixel size/resolution in both export and Print, I cannot really see any significant difference. They use the same scaler and the same compression algorithm as far as I know.

Why do exported JPGs appear darker than the processed RAW in the LR3 Development module?

I have scoured the forums with this question, and I have seen plenty of suggestions about color space and monitor calibration. However, I never seem to find that the issue gets resolved in the forums.
I am using Lightroom 3, and I am exporting to JPG using sRGB. I have noticed that the JPGs appear darker and the prints are also darker. I am using the same monitor to process in LR and to view the exported JPG. Why don't the images look the same, or at least similar? The difference is pretty huge.

rasu wrote:
… What do you mean by export in an mp4 wrapper? Do you mean export it as an mp4 format instead of H264?? …
no, exactly I did NOT meant that.
that's why I phrased 'wrapper':
a bit confusing, but there's mpeg4, the codec, and there's mp4 the wrapper or media-container:
• use your .mov you have already exported, which has the right colors.
• download/install the free tool Mpeg Streamclip
• open your mov, go straight to 'save as' and choose from drop down mp4
• save and upload that mp4 for comparison to Vimeo
• (tell us, wether you notice any difference, as said, just an assumption)
What will that do?
your h264 encoded material is actually in a .mov-wrapper
Streamclip unwraps that, and puts it into a .mp4-wrapper
this does NOT encode/transcode/affect your h264 material!
it just changes the box, not the chocolate!
What's NOT working is changing the suffix in a Finder operation - that does NOT affect the 'atoms' of the wrapper = a re-named mp4 will be 'noticed' by many programs/players as a mov anyhow! You HAVE to go the 'long' way with Streamclip - due to the simple re-packing operation, that process needs only seconds
I'm using this process to 'convert' my FCPX/iMovie .mov-exports to a readable format for my son's Playstation3 ... mov is a nogo, re-named suffix is a nogo. only re-wrapping to .mp4 works. excellent.
... but, as mentioned, I do care very little about gamma and luma as an hobbyist, my 'products' are under-exposured and veeery colorful anyhow

PS CS action not working on Lightroom-exported JPGs

Hi,
I am using an old version of Photoshop (CS) and the latest version of Lightroom.
I export the Lightroom image as a JPG, then open in Photoshop (either via LR Droplet as part of post-processing or manually). I try to run two actions: 1) resize the photo, and 2) add watermark using a .PDF file. What happens is the following:
- I can run the "resize" action and it works fine, but the "add watermark" action does not work - it adds the blank layer background and the watermark is missing
- If I run the "add watermark" action first, before resizing, that works fine. However, I would like to resize first and THEN add the watermark.
Please note that these two actions, in any order, work perfectly with normal JPGs. I am only seeing this problem on a .JPG that has been exported from Lightroom.
I have tried adding the graphical watermark in Lightroom upon expert, but it just does not look as good as when I add it in Photoshop, which is why I need this extra PS step.
Any comments and insights would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

No, this is true for all jpegs. When manually saving a jpeg with layers in PS, PS will show a caution symbol in the save dialog box. In the latest versions of PS it defaults ot saving the file as a copy and merging automatically. It leaves the original file intact, though. I dont remember what PS CS1 did by default. Point being that when running this process as an action, PS may have to decide what to do with the layer without user input.
Jpegs created in LR are the same as any other jpgs. It very well may be a color space issue with the pdf. The jpegs that you are used to might be in sRGB and you might be exporting AdobeRGB(98) or ProPhoto from LR.
Another possiblity would be where the pdf is located on your system. PS actions may be using relative paths instead of absolutes. IDK... that would be something for the PS forum.
My plan of attack would be:
1. Check the color space used on export.
2. Add a merge visible to your action.
3. Save the PDF watermark as a jpeg.

Exported JPGs in 2.7 are 3x size of Camera Raw

I have a Canon 5DMarkII and I noticed that the exported jpgs from full size RAW files are 17-25 MB whereas the same file in Camera Raw saves as about a 6-7 MB file. I have the LR export set to export JPG files with sRGB color space. When I take a jpg straight from the camera it's only 6-7 MB. Does anyone know what my problem is? Thanks.

No image resize. .... Sharpen STD for screen.
If you don't resize, you probably shouldn't use output sharpening. The screen sharpen is mostly to counteract the softening effect of downsizing your image. Apart from that, at full size, it will likely mostly emphasize noise and therefore increase your filesize. Just optimize the capture sharpening in Develop (make sure to optimize the masking parameter, which will cut down in noise in areas such as skies) so that your image looks good at 1:1 and then don't apply extra sharpening in the export. At ISO 400, you also might want to add a touch of noise reduction. With the switch from 2.6 to 2.7, the demosaic algorithm changed and now includes less noise reduction in the demosaic stage, so in 2.7 most images are going to show a little more noise with the default settings. Jpeg compression efficiency is very sensitive to noise and often you can correlate the filesize directly with the amount of noise in the image for equal quality settings.

How do I export jpgs as tifs with the original resolution ?

Hi,
I am very new to Lightroom 5 (I only installed it today (on Windows 8.1) :-)) but I have read Victoria Bampton's Quick Start Guide and have read a number of forum posts over the last few weeks to get an idea about how the program generally works.
I am embarking on a project to scan and archive my family's photos and videos, and I will be using Lightroom to manage the collection. To start the project, I have just imported over 10,000 digital photos taken by a variety of cameras (36 of them, according to Lightroom !) over the last 12 years or so into a new Lightroom catalogue.   These are all currently JPEG files, but I want to keep TIFF files in the collection because my research has led me to the conclusion that TIFF is a better long-term archival format.
I started by doing an Export of a small number of photos to save the .jpg files as .tif files, but when reviewing the results, I noticed that the image's resolution was changed during the export. For example, one original jpg is only 96ppi but the exported tif is 240ppi. Another jpg is 180ppi and the tif is 240ppi. At least, that's what the metadata seems to be telling me (via the Details tab of the Properties dialog in Windows), so I assume it's true...
I understand that the 240ppi that I am seeing in the .tif file metadata was specified in the Image Sizing section of the Export dialog, so that's not the issue.
I would prefer it if the .tif file has the exact same resolution (ppi) as the original .jpg, but I am unable to work out how to do it.   It would be great if the resolution setting in the Export dialog was controlled by the Resize to Fit checkbox, like the other settings in the section, but it doesn't appear to be (it's enabled even if the Resize to Fit checkbox is unticked).
I then thought about using the Library Filters to filter by the Horizontal Resolution metadata, so that I could select all the photos with the same resolution and export just those with the Resolution setting in the Export dialog set to the right number, and then repeat that process for each different group of original photos with a different resolution. Unfortunately, I have not been able to work out how to filter by the horizontal resolution metadata field - it doesn't seem to be available in the dropdown list of fields shown when I click on the up-down arrow next to the "Date" or "Camera" (etc.) columns in the Library Filter pane.
Finally, here's my question (or three):
Is there a way to export .jpgs to .tif files while keeping the original resolution ?
Alternatively, is there a way to select groups of photos by their horizontal or vertical resolution (so just those photos could be exported in a group with the right resolution specified) ?
Or is there any other way to do what I want (convert jpg to tif with the same resolution and keeping all the metadata) ?
Thanks for reading all the way through to the end.
John.

These are all currently JPEG files, but I want to keep TIFF files in the collection because my research has led me to the conclusion that TIFF is a better long-term archival format.
I'm not sure why you say this. In terms of long-term archival format, I think the two are equal, I am not aware of other reasons to do this, and thus in my opinion, the task of globally turning all your JPGs into TIFFs seems unnecessary. You don't gain anything by doing this. But you sure will spend a lot of time and take up a lot of disk space doing this.
I would prefer it if the .tif file has the exact same resolution (ppi) as the original .jpg, but I am unable to work out how to do it.
Again, I think you have embarked upon an unnecessary task. The ppi in the file is essentially meaningless. A photo that has (for example) 3000x2000 pixels saved at 240 ppi is the exact same photo as the same photo 3000x2000 saved at 180ppi, not a single pixel has changed. You are placing a meaning and importance to this ppi number that just doesn't exist.
To answer your questions at the bottom, I would advise you to not do the things you are talking about, it seems to me that you have greatly misunderstood things.

Script for moving playhead to last frame, then exporting jpg?

Hi,
I have a lot of Flash files for which I need to export jpgs of their last frame. Could a kind soul out there guide me on how to write a command for moving the timeline's playhead to the last frame, then exporting a jpg (at Full Document Size, 72 dpi, 96% quality)?
A million thanks,
Kevin

private function snapshotLastFrame():void
gotoAndStop( this.totalFrames );
_bitmapData                         = new BitmapData( stage.stageWidth, stage.stageHeight );
_bitmap                              = new Bitmap( _bitmapData );
_bitmapData.draw ( stage );
saveImageJPG( _bitmapData, "test.jpg", 96 );
public function saveImageJPG( bitmapData:BitmapData, fileName:String, quality:int ):void {
            this.jpgEncoder = new JPGEncoder( quality );
            this.fileReference = new FileReference();
            this.fileReference.save( this.jpgEncoder.encode( bitmapData ), fileName + ".jpg" );
Keep in mind that you need a few extra libraries to be able to create a jpeg.. (AS3CoreLib) can be found at googleCode.

Export jpg to new folder just copy unmodified pics

Is there a way to export jpg files to a new folder and let lightroom process only the modified pictures and leave others untouched. Here is a short example what I mean by that:
1. I take 100 photos
2. I apply edits to 50 of the photos, the other 50 look fine as is.
3. I want to export all the photos to a new folder with new names based on the event.
4. Of course my altered JPEGs will need to be reprocessed and resaved with varying degrees of JPEG compression.
5. But the photos that were not altered I’d simply like copied to the new folder with in sequence filenames
Is there a way to do that with lightroom?

Lightroom cannot do it automatically, I mean, deciding which one to export as a new recomressed JPEG and which one to just copy.
So, you'll have to separate the two groups manually and perform two separate exports.
1. Use the Library filter to separate by "Develop settings": Untouched JPEGS will be in the "Default" group, while edited jpegs will either be in custom or a develop preset.
2. Export edited with the jpeg settings you need.
3. Export unedited as "original".

LR2: export jpg sRGB vs. print to jpeg sRGB - Same colors in MS explorer preview?

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