HD Scaling to 960x540@30 fps or 1280x720@24 fps?

Wondering what the best way is to get source material (1080i or 720p, 60 fps) onto the ATV with the least quality degredation, two target file options being 960x540@30 fps and 1280x720@24 fps. Based on a little bit of fooling around, seems like former maybe looks the best (my display a large 1080p), latter has better resolution, but picture is a little jumpy, presumably from the reverse 3:2 pulldown that I suppose is happening. I am working with source material from EyeTV, if anyone thinks that makes a difference. And actually, exporting from EyeTV to 24fps might give a smoother result than exporting at 60 fps and doing the 24fps conversion with Quicktime. Not a lot of good information on this stuff out there, which I find surprising. Maybe an opportunity for someone!

Changing frame rate wouldn't be something I would do, but I have compared 720p and 540p at 25 fps, 25 fps is our native frame rate in PAL land and unlike 30 fps is accepted by the tv at 720p.
See my comparisons.
I suspect the fact that 540p is exactly half the vertical resolution has a great deal to do with things, but any difference there is, isn't worth the additional work of applying manual settings in my opinion, indeed I'm not so sure the slight difference is in favour of 720p anyway.

Similar Messages

1920x1080 30 fps to 1280x720 24 fps

I have a Canon HFS100 and shot video on the highest setting which when imported in IM 09 (full) saves as 1920x1080 @ 30 fps. I would like to save this as 1280x720 24 fps to play on ATV. Is there a way to convert w/out causing "jerky" playback. (in other words - when exported w/ QT - yes you can get a 1280x720 24 fps but playback is noticeably missing the frames from 30 to 24).

I have been using 960x540 and it does look excellent. I only ask because I did import 1280x720 (conversion using quicktime) and although it was "jerky" it appeared as HD (slightly better than 960x540). If the conversion to 24p is not possible, or time consuming & complicated it is probably not worth it.

How should I combine 30 fps clips and 24 fps clips into a project?

I have both 30 fps footage and 24 fps footage and I would like to create a project that has both. Should I create a 30-fps project or a 24-fps project? Which one will look better?

A little bit. Mostly just playing around.
I would start with 30fps so you can preserve the higher frame rate.
Another consideration is how much of your content is 30fps and how much is 24fps.
If you're doing a lot of this kind of thing you may find the FinalCut Pro X handles it better.
Matt
Message was edited by: Matthew Morgan

Smooth Slow Motion from 50 fps Clip in 50 fps Timeline

If I want 50% smooth slow motion from a 50 FPS video clip, I would normally ask PP to interpret that clip as 25 FPS - that works great.
If however I import the 50 FPS video clip and interprett it as 50 FPS, I would have to set the speed of the video clip in the timeline to 50% to get the same level of slow motion.
The question is - when I follow the latter method, does PP create new frames for the slow motion or is it clever enough to use all the frames from the original 50 FPS video clip? to put it another away, does PP always generate NEW frames for slow motion or does it try to use the frames we are attempting to ignore?
I've done some basic tests and so far I can't see any real difference between the two methods. This leads me to beleive PP is effectively using all of the original 50 frames when the 50 fps video clip is imported into a 50 fps timeline and then slowed down in the timeline by 50%. - if this is the case, well done PP!!! If this is not the case, then it would be a welcomed enhancement in future releases.
I guess what you are all wondering is why would I want to import a 50 fps video clip into a 50 fps timeline and then slow it down in the timeline - well, as a wedding Videographer, it is simply because some parts of the video need to be in slow motion and other parts like messages and speeches need to be interpreted at normal speed. If playback in the timeline is at normal speed, i find it simpler to slow down the "Walking Down the Isle" clips rather than having to speed up the speeaches and messages.
In short, when importing 50 fps video for smooth slow motion, are both the following methods equally effective in terms of smooth motion?
Method 1: Import the 50 fps video clip into 25 fps timeline
Method 2: import the 50 fps video clip into 50 fps timeline and set the speed of the video clip in the timeline to 50% - I'm assuming PP does not generate new frames and gets them from the original 50 fps file instead..
To put it another way, does PP ALWAYS attempt to generate new fromes when slowing down video in the timeline? When extra frames are available in the original video file, does PP try to get the extra frames from that file instead of generating new ones?

I recorded 2 video clips of the same scene. The camera was panning from right to left.
First video clip - recorded at 25 fps
second video clip - recorded at 50 fps
Both video clips recorded at the same panning speed of the same scene.
1. If I import the 25 fps video into 25 fps timeline and slow it down by 50%, the exported video looks jerky.
2. If I import the 50 fps video clip into 25 fps timeline, the exported video looks smooth motion.
3. If I import the 50 fps video clip into 50 fps timeline, slow it down in the timeline by 50%, and export the video as 25 fps then the result is still smooth motion.
I've only done the experiment once and may have to repeat to be absolutely sure.

PAL 25 fps conversion to 24 fps.

Forum,
I have read 24 fps produces a "nicer" look than Pal 25 fps or NTSC 30 fps.
So have spent some time searching for the means to change the PAL footage to 24 fps. without using Cinema tools.
Of course there is an option in Tools.
So I selected a scene in the time line and choose conform 25 to 24 in tools.
Well it tells me the footage is not 25 fps.
This news to me as the camera is set to to PAL and I thought PAL is shot at 25 fps?
Comments and help would be most welcome.
Thank you
Michael.

Well it tells me the footage is not 25 fps.
This news to me as the camera is set to to PAL and I thought PAL is shot at 25 fps?
PAL is 25 fps. It's possible that you made a mistake somewhere along the line.
Open the original media (inside the Capture Scratch folder) in QuickTime Player
and choose Get Info. Is the framerate 25? If not, then you captured it incorrectly
or you accidentally changed it.
Cinema Tools works great for conforming, but if you try something, it will
save to the file without asking you. Maybe that happened while you were
experimenting.
So I selected a scene in the time line and choose conform 25 to 24 in tools.
To conform you need to select the clip in the Browser, not the Timeline.
If you conform the clip, then the file gets changed, so every instance
on the Timeline is changed.
When you've got your 25 footage conformed to 24, you'll notice that the
sound is pitched lower, so you'll need to change the pitch of the sound track + 4.17%.
Of course, the question remains: does it look "nicer"?

24 fps to 29.97 fps-

I’m in a pickle so to speak. I’m editing an independent feature film shot on super 16mm. The director wanted to go back to negative. So I went through Cinema Tools to do the reverse telecine. I imported the files into FCP and edited everything at 24 fps. Well after much time that has passed I’m ready to hand this over to the sound people. However, the director doesn’t have the budget now to go to film so he wants to online the source tapes.
How do I convert my project/timeline back to 29.97 fps?

Well the film is already edited at 24 fps. Would love to have the online editor deal with the 29.97 fps situation but I know I need to be involved. The director wants this to be at 29.97 fps. Wish he told me that at the start!!!
Right now I have to deal with the sound editor and music composer. The online is several weeks away. I know that in a music video that I edited recently in HD that I edited in 23.98 fps and then converted a guide quicktime video to 29.97 fps for the sound editor. He gave me the audio and it played in sync with my 23.98 fps HD footage.
The problem now is I can't seem to convert my 24 fps to 29.97 fps for the sound editor and composer. I believe that they need to have my guide video at 29.97 fps for them to stay in sync because the final video master will be 29.97 fps.
So how do I get there from here???

High fps footage in Low fps project - Conform Speed

Hi Y'all. I'm using the GoPro3 and it shoots beautiful 1080p60. I hope to preserve the integrity of this footage and make it work the most for me with slow-motion in a 30fps project.
1) What frame rate should I export my videos for web viewing, 30fps or 60 fps? Does YouTube or Vimeo have preferred frame rates, or do they take whatever file you have and force it to, say, 30fps?
(For my taste I think that 30fps looks good, i've seen some new TV shows that incorporate 60fps and it looks off to me.. TOO crisp or something, anybody else notice that / feel that way?)
2) If I bring a 60fps clip into a 30fps project, it still retains it's 60fps information correct? If I'm copy and pasting these clips between different projects with different frame rates, i'm not affecting the clip itself, am I?
3) Is there any difference between a) using the 'Conform Speed' command and b) simply retiming 60fps footage in a 30fps project to 50% retime? I wonder if there's any other magic behind the 'Conform Speed' feature that I should be aware of.
Thank you for all your help.
Lovin' FCPX!

3. So what is different between these two actions:
A) conforming 60fps footage to a 30fps project and
B) retiming 60fps footage to 50% in a 30fps project
Is conform simply a mathematical scaling function for retime based upon clip/project framerates (in which actions A and B would have the same result)?
Or do you know if there more too the conform function that i'm not anticipating?

I want to show 25 fps artifact in 24 fps edit.

When I put a scene shot at 25 fps into an FCPX edit that has a 24 fps basis, there is a grayed-out, checked item in the "Rate Conform" effect box with Frame Sampling set to "Floor". And the final result is that the scene looks fine. No twitch on playback.
But in this case, I don't want fine. I want to see the 25 vs 24 artifact—the once-per-second twitch forward. But it seems that FCPX has its heart set on not showing that artifact.
I've attempted to Retime that clip to "Normal 100%" to see if that helped, but no dice.
How do I get it to fail?
Editing the same clip in iMovie DOES produce the twitch, but the overall image quality is lower.

I'll start you out with the most basic way to achieve this:
1. Create a new title from the Final Cut Title in the project browser.
2. Select the Text and go to the Inspector.
4. At the right side of the Size parameter, click the down facing arrow and go to the Add Parameter Behavior option, then select Randomize from the parameter behaviors.
-When you select this, it should switch you to the behavior tab. The behavior is now applied to the text
6. Set the apply to mode to "Add and Subtract"
7. Set the amount to zero.
8. Publish the Amount parameter.
9. Save your project.
This is the most basic way to achieve what you have described. Now whatever the font size, as you increase the Amount setting in FCPX, the text will randomly scale up/down For example, if you have a font size of 24 and the amount is set to 10, the size will be randomized between 14 and 34.
Again, this is the most basic way to do it and from here there's plenty to play with if you want (Frequency, Noisiness, Smooth or Jumpy). You can start to build rigs to control addtional features. With that, I highly recomend you take the time to start reviewing the documentation and start looking at some online videos. For this case, I'd point you to the sections on Publishing, Rigging and Behaviors.
http://help.apple.com/motion/mac/5.1/
http://help.apple.com/motion/mac/5.1/#motn13748883
http://help.apple.com/motion/mac/5.1/#motn13f20610
http://help.apple.com/motion/mac/5.1/#motn17691fe6

Ntsc (60 fps) vs PAL (50 fps)?

Hi all,
I have to choose between NTSC with 60 FPS or PAL with 50 fps on my new GoPro camera (black edition hero3+). What should I do? I live in the Netherlands, so intuitively would go for PAL. But that lowers the framerate possibilities. Higher framerate will enhance my plans to edit certain parts in slowmotion. So, is it possible to shoot with NTSC at 60 fps, edit this movie (in a 60 fps project), burn it to blu ray with loss of quality? Or should I choose for PAL 50 fps?
Thanks in advance for all for the help!
Hugo

Your thought processes are almost correct. Shoot 60fps and edit 25fps.
The frames per second for your sequence have little to do with the frames per second of your footage when you are shooting with the intention of playing it back in slow motion.
Now that we are not using interlaced footage, and we are not trying to solve the problems of frame size differences between PAL and NTSC, there is little difference between me shooting at 60fps to put it on a 24fps timeline, and you putting it on a 25fps timeline. At least not for the slow motion footage.
The slow motion footage will show every frame when you interpret the footage to 25fps. No problem. It will look great.
The question is, what will the 60fps footage look like when put on a 25fps sequence at normal speed? Keep in mind the shutter speed is different when shooting 25 or 60.
And I say "little" difference. The math of 60 to 24 might be easier for the program than 60 to 25. I doubt it. After all, it is just a matter of dropping frames.
So that leaves the footage content itself. If it can survive the dropped frames, then great! If it is a little choppy, then it really wasn't suitable.
You have to decide that for yourself. My suggestion is to shoot some sample footage for practice before you do it for anything important. Get to know your camera and how 60fps looks on a 25fps timeline on a BD.

60 fps video become 30 fps in PC

I took some 60 fps videos with my iPhone 6 ,
after sent them to my PC,
they became 30 fps

Hi ColaKenH,
If you are having issues or questions about working with slow motion video from your iPhone 6, you may find the following article helpful:
What to expect when you import slow-motion video from your iPhone, iPad, or iPod to your Mac or PC - Apple Support
Regards,
- Brenden

Change the sequence settings from NTSC 30 fps to PAL 25 fps, is possible?

Hello,
I have a finished project that was make in a sequence with the format NTSC 30 fps. Now I need to change that sequence and the project to PAL 25 fps. I have changed the settings of the source secuence to PAL 25, but in the resulting sequence the audio and the videos are different in time and speed.
With the videos I have make a match frame to find the source, but with the audios I have problems. ¿There is a automatic proccess in final cut pro 7.0 that could make a translation of a finished sequence that was developed in NTSC 30 ftp to a PAL 25 fps?
Can you give me a tip or something to make the trasnlation ?
Thanks in advance

Sorry...but it isn't as simple as changing a project frame rate. FCP is NOT good at mixing frame rates. And when you put NTSC footage (29.97fps), into a PAL timeline (25fps), that is exactly what you are doing. No, this won't work. No magic solution for this (although Avid MC5 does this nicely).
You are going to have to export a QT file, and let Compressor tackle this job (and it will take a WHILE, and you will have to run a few tests to see if your settings work to your satisfaction), or take that QT file to a post house with a Terranex or Snell/Wilcox to do the conversion ($$$$)...or output to tape AND THEN do the Terranex thing.
No easy button here.
Shane

Hi-def playback is CHOPPY - 60 FPS to 29.97 FPS????

Hi - I have a Powerbook G4, with 1.67 GHz, and 1.5 GB SDRAM.
I have some AVCHD footage I converted using Voltaic, from the Panasonic HDC-SD9.
Picture is great, color is great, but the playback in iMovie is choppy. Is it simply that my computer cannot handle the huge files? Upon rendering to Quicktime movie, Divx, whatever, the same result: choppy motion.
The original footage is in 60 FPS (but I can only view it from the camera monitor, since there is no way to import to the computer and view in the AVCHD format) and Voltaic is converting to 29.97 FPS, is that where the chokehold is?
This is very frustrating - I have a great computer, and a great camera - and a choppy video!
Look at it here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkPykgDWSEs
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Many thanks,
Hammydon

The "60i" setting on the camcorder is 60 interlaced fields per second ..which equals 30 full frames per second ..that is the normal US frame rate.
At least, it's called 30 fps for brevity, but it is actually 29.97 frames per sec ..so that's what Voltaic is - supposedly - receiving, and everything is working correctly.
The YouTube video shows a smooth frame rate (..the view of the static buildings isn't interrupted or stuttery..) but there appear to be frames missing within the video: hence the jumps in motion of the cars and bike. That looks like a Voltaic problem: it looks like it's choking on receiving and trying to convert the AVCHD ..because it's underpowered for what you're trying to do.
Your choice of new Mac should work perfectly. HOWEVER, several people have reported problems with iMovie recognising or handling the incoming video from a Panny SD9, whereas there've been no problems with its predecessor SD5 (..mine works OK, for instance, on an Intel-powered Mac - except that conversion to the editable AIC format is slow because I'm using a slow Mac mini).
So you might like to investigate further whether an SD9 behaves OK with Macs.
Note too that only iMovie '08 will natively handle AVCHD video straight from the camcorder, so even with an new Intel Mac, you'd still need to convert your AVCHD with Voltaic if you continue to use iMovie HD 6 (..you posted this question in the iMovie HD 6 Discussions).

Use 60 fps footage in 24 fps timeline

I will apologize in advance because this is sort of a stupid question but I swear I have been told there is an easy way to do this...
I have a timeline that is in 24 fps. I also have a few shots that are shot at 60 fps. While I could just put the 60 fps clip into the timeline since frames get dropped it looks very intense and jittery. Now, I know I can conform these to 24 fps using cinema tools but that makes them slow motion.
Is there anyway or any programs that will allow me to conform the 60fps footage into 24 fps without turning them to slow motion?

and set everything to BEST...
... then go have a nice dinner at a restaurant with linen table cloths, a good night's sleep, a leisurely breakfast, a late lunch and stop by to check on the process before you start the cycle again.
Best is VERY computationally intensive. I'd start with "Better" in frame controls and see if it gives you acceptable results. If not, then go the "best" - and living large - route.
Cheers,
x

50 fps in a 50 fps project - or 25fps project?

Hi.
My normal working method today is to shoot 50fps 720, then import in a 50fps project. What goes in comes out, basically. I guess shooting in 50fps and then working in the same rate makes the pictures sharper, than simply shooting 25fps and editing in 25...
But.. I need some tips on how to maximize the potensial of my clips. If I shoot in 50fps I do have a lot (2x) more information than a simple 25fps shoot. So would I be better of just editing in 25fps by default? In order to be able to slow down some parts for instance...
I usually don’t use slow mo (as I mainly do ENG). But there are times when I do want to use it, and since it wasn’t planned from the beginning, i did not consider this as I started editing in my regular 50fps project....
Any thoughts, tips and suggestions on this matter would be very much appreciated..
I might add a few more things to think about..
My camera supports 50mbps 50p 720 - but once I go up to 1080 50p is no longer an option, only 25p or 50i (and I have learned to avoid interlacing).

Morphyx wrote:
… I guess shooting in 50fps and then working in the same rate makes the pictures sharper, than simply shooting 25fps and editing in 25...…
I start with a plain "No!" …
'sharpness' is, aside 'glas'/focus/ …, dependent on shutter-speed.
slow shutter-speed = more motion blurr.
Ol' Silverbacks from TinsleTown will tell you the 180°-rule … a 25fps should be recorded with 1/50thsec, a 50fps would be 1/100th sec shutter speed - modern camera techniqués allow all sort-of of aparture, speed, iso, fps. But for sure, you can not apply 1/20th shutter-speed to a 50p recording
Sharpness is part of 'quality', defined by resolution & bitrate, for sure focus, but DoF too (the actual 'look' asks for blurry bavkgrounds). But framerate …?
(compare to the actual debate about HFR in The Hobbit)
sooo, the usual question:
What do you want to accomplish, what 'look', what format?
(motion blurr is a wanted effect for all those 'film look'-afficionados)
'ENG' means TVbroadcast - never heard of any station asking for 50fps material (???) …
How do you deliver, what do your clients ask for?
a 50p delivery is rarely seen on Web video - but demands twice the bandwidth.
50p is perfect, when you do lots of slowmo (sports), but your projects then are 25fps.
otherwise, I see no 'use' for 50p in ENG.-
… My camera supports 50mbps …
excellent specs, … and, e.g. minimum for German broadcasters
If you don't do 'for art's sake' your private projects, I would work in a standard predetermined by your contractees.

30 fps shot into 24 fps sequence w/out frame removal

I want to cut a 30 fps shot into my 24 fps sequence, but I don't want to lose any frames. Instead, I'm prepared to have the shot play at 80% speed (24/30 = .8). But I can't figure out how to do this. If I simply cut the shot into the sequence frames get lost. How would I go about this?
Thanks, Martin

Well, that is a viable option for DVCPRO HD footage that is 59.94 that you want to convert to 23.98 slow motion. It transfers frame for frame and slows it down. But, because of the results you got, I think that might be behavior limited to DVCPRO HD.
Then I don't know what you can use. After Effects perhaps?
Shane

HD Scaling to 960x540@30 fps or 1280x720@24 fps?

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