Near lossless HDV export?

Does CS3 have settings for near lossless HDV export - for those segments of the timeline where the video is unchanged? For example, let's say I have four HDV mpeg2 clips. The first two are clips that butt up against each other: no transitions, no effects. Clip 2 cross-dissolves into clip 3. Clip 4 has effects. In near lossless, I would imagine that for clips 1 and 2, CS3 would copy the frames (GOPs?) with no data change (instead of rerendering) up until the first dissolve. At the beginning of the dissolve CS3 would render and then, after the dissolve, go back to laying down an exact copy of the part of the mpeg on the timeline that was unchanged. For clip 4, CS3 would have to completely rerender.
Is this a nutty question? Or is there a setting to tell CS3: just copy the mpeg2 HDV video exactly - when possible?
Thanks in advance!

The question is not nutty but uninformed. Datawise there is no such thing as a single frame in native HDV. You should know that HDV is a compressed format which combines information over multiple frames. In other words a group of frames are compressed together and the processor decompresses them into separate frames when you watch the video. However, when you render, the processor re-combines multiple frames. Therefore you can not render on the frame.
The only way to render on the frame is to use a codec which decompresses the native formet once and for all into single frames. From there on you can go down many generations with minimum loss.
Use the award winning Cineform codec, either Aspect or Prospect (Aspect works perfectly for me).

Similar Messages

Lossless HDV export

If your captured files are HDV (from an FX1 for example), after you have edited this down to just the stuff you would like to keep, is there a way to export this from the timeline into the same format as the original capture files? Would this be just MPEG 2? Is there anyway to tell it to not recompress unless it has to for a transition or other special effect? I am looking for some way to store the finished videos in a form that I can later use to store on Blueray without losing quality.

Hi C.David,
I have done extensive testing of this with CS3. The .M2T export is NOT lossless. I'm a videophile and compared the footage on a few different HD displays, and a 1920x1080p projector. Even if you do no filters, overlays, color correction, etc., just straight cuts then re-export to HDV (via the export to tape/pull the cable trick) .M2T, you will see artifacting during scenes of extreme motion or scenes where the MPEG encoder has a very hard time with (my torture test is a pan following a woman walking along a beach where the ground is all stones, all the small stones are a killer for mpeg encoding). There is very noticeable motion artifacting on the .M2T output as compared with the original M2T shot from the camera.
BTW, I also did extensive experimentation with using some type of AVI intermediary, for both editing and as an output format, and NO avi, whether it's cineform or using smth like Lagarith lossless, provides the same degree of "3D" or "you are there" feeling as the original M2T footage has. Even if there is no 'generation loss' in terms of motion artifacts or loss of resolution, there is a definite and visible deterioration of the image quality when using either an AVI intermediary for editing (regardless of what kind of AVI) or outputting to avi. I was going to write a detailed report about this but I've been too busy...
Best results, by far, for me come with editing in native m2t and outputting to H.264 at about 30mpbs.
It really is a bummer. Re-encoding in PPro CS3 does have a generation loss, even without adding effects. Best results I've gotten is exporting to 1920x1440 H.264 at 25-30mbps (and then I distribute on BluRay or WMVHD for the web).
Best,
Patrick

HDV exports have new sound sync problem in Quick Time

Hi
I'm on FCP 5.1.4. Prior to a few weeks ago, I've had no issue with exporting HDV files and playing on QuickTime. Now, regardless of the Quicktime Conversion I use, the exported video lags the sound. I went back to old projects and exported. Same thing. All the clips play fine in FCP. QuickTime is 7.5. I've read elsewhere people have had to downgrade to prior versions of QT. Anyone have a similar problem or have an idea what the root cause might be?
Specs of captured footage (pretty normal)
Capture video: 1440x1080
Copressor: HDV108060i
Video Rate: 29.97
Audeo: 48hz
Hope we can get some help here because I know others have the problem--and like me--are dead in the water on projects.
Thanks,
Phil

Figured out a solution. For those of you who have equipment/software similar to mine, FCP 5.4.1, IMAC G5 and QT 7.5. My project had multiple layered soundtracks. Sending to QT with any kind of compression didn't work. I wanted to ultimately get to an IPOD format. Here's what I did:
Export project as self-contained movie.
Open QT (don't just click on the file - it'll launch FCP).
Open the reference file you just made.
It'll open, but probably stutter because size of raw file; doesn't matter.
Stop QT from playing.
Choose Export; then any file type you want that's smaller.
I chose IPOD.
Works flawlessly.

HDV export preset?

I began my motion project with an HDV 1080i 60 preset.
When it came time to export I exported to a quicktime file using the HDV1080i60 compressor. (1440x1080)
When go into FCP and try and drop the file into an HDV 1080i60 sequence I am forced to render...
How can this be when all settings are equivalent.
I also noticed that there is no HDV preset for export in motion, even with the HDV settings motion is calling the export preset a "customized" DV NTSC movie
Any suggestions on how to get it in to FCP w/o rendering again?

Although I don't use HDV, I use DVDPROHD, I think I can answer your question since they work the same in Motion. FCP needs to render a Motion project regardless of what settings you've picked in Motion - in Motion, the settings are not tied to a specific codec, they're simply width/height/frame rate/etc. Think of a Motion project on the FCP timeline as an uncompressed file with HDV dimensions and frame rate - FCP needs to render the file before it can play in realtime alongside the HDV-compressed material you are editing with.
So, you can either let FCP do the rendering of the uncompressed file to HDV, or you can do it in Motion by exporting to HDV codec, but either way, a render of some kind has to take place, it's just a question of where you do it. The advantage of letting FCP do it is the round-tripping works better since you can go back and edit the Motion file multiple times without re-importing, so that's usually the best way to handle it.
Motion didn't include a DVDPROHD preset, either. Hitting the Options button just temporarily modifies whatever preset is currently shown in the list, which is why it says customized on the DV NTSC export preset after you change it. But that's ok - I made my own, there's a preferences pane in Motion where you can make new export presets. I just copied one of the existing ones, renamed it to DVDPRO HD 720p 30 QT, and set up the codec and other settings how I wanted it. I made that the default and now I get DVCPRO HD movies every time I export, it should work exactly the same for HDV.
PowerMac G5 1.8 Ghz

HDV export to H.264 jittery within Media Encoder

I'm rendering out a 50 minute documentary shot and edited in HDV 60i. I did it within Premeire Pro CS4 using Adobe Media Encoder CS4. First I exported it as a Quicktime H.264 1920x1080 29.97 progressive video. The video looks PERFECT, and is 31GB.
Trying to get the video file to less than 4.7 gb to burn onto a dvd as a image file, I then exported both the PP timeline and the QT H.264 file in Meda Encoder to the MP4 H.264 1920x1080 29.97 progressive and it came out to 4.5 GB. The image quality looks good, but scences that have a lot of movement the video is noticably jittery. The reason I want this encode to work is because I would like to be able to burn the HD image file to DVD to distribute along with the regular SD DVD. Does anybody know why it's jittery? Is there a setting I have to change? Is there another Codec someone could recomend to get me under 4.7 HD while keeping the full HD quality?
Funny thing is if I play the jittery MP4 H.264 though my Western Digital HD player (plays 1080 movies off a portable usb hard drive to a television monitor up to 1080p via HDMI cable) it plays perfect, no jitters. But if I burn the same file to dvd and open on another computer (after copy/paste to hard drive) it is jittery.
Thanks for the help!!

Ryan,
Please submit a bug report here:
http://adobe.ly/ReportBug
I agree with you that the error message should be more helpful, and I consider the fact that the existing error message is misleading to be a bug.

Hdv export wrong format on a .mov file.

i've set up a hdv project and both the easy setup and sequense settings says : hcv 1080i50 1440x1080. But when I export using quicktime conversion with any codec and setup(allmost) I get a.mov file with a streched format.
why is that I ask.
dual 2.5 G5 Mac OS X (10.3.6)
dual 2.5 G5 Mac OS X (10.3.6)

hmmm.. sorry don't get it. Have I overlooked any settings when exporting using conversions? because i'm pretty sure i didn't.. OOOOOHH wait a minut. I think I get it.
blush
I can't use "current size" i need to manually put in the frame size?
Auch.. you have cought me in some pretty silly posts here... thanks though

Quicktime Pro HDV export chunky blocks

Hi, I've edited HDV captured material in FCP and exported full res. Then, in Quicktime I open the .mov. It seems to contain chuncky blocks. When I close and open, the same happens, but not in the same places?
When I export the movie from QT 7.5.4 (25) it also shows these blocks, but they're now permanent. Anyone? I've found a similar discussion at Creative Cow: http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/162/868047

Just to follow up, after some more testing.
Here is a screenshot of what I am seeing. http://2ndmileproductions.com/downloads/Picture-1.jpg
The glitches happen on a 1080i file exported from FCP when viewing them in QT. BUT when I scrub back frame by frame using the arrow keys, no glitches. They dissappear, meaning they are not "embedded" in the file. If I view the same file in FCP, no glitches at all.
The screenshot is from taking the 1080i file from FCP and exporting from QT at a 720p. Scrubbing back reveals that the glitches are embedded in the file.
From the screen shot you can see that the glitches are overlaying 2-3 frames from the previous cut. It seems to happen 20-40 frames after the cut.
Playing the file back in VLC reveals that about the same time these glitches appear, the video stutters, but does not glitch.
If I down-convert the HDV file to an MPEG through Compressor, no glitches.
I hope this helps as this problem has been bugging me for a while now.

Messed up HDV exporting in FCP

Hi!
I use FCP 5.1 to capture HDV1080i50 from a Canon XH A1. When I try to export using Quicktime conversion and HDV1080i50 the image gets messed up. I have no idea why, anybody know? If I open the original HDV file in Quicktime and export using the same settings, the exported version is fine..
Thanks for your help!
http://bildr.no/view/102713

What QT conversion are you trying to get to?
Why not try exporting from the timeline to Compressor and making your conversion there.
Good Luck
Z1

FCP7 HDV Export

Ok I have read many ppost with many good ideas on exporting 1080i60, what is the best way to deal with HDV the Red Headed HD Stepchild.
Sequence Preset HDV1080i60. What compressor do i use? capture preset?
Now
Now exporting finished to Prores 422. for the web.
can you tell i am having issurs from the start.
dave

Capture as ProRes 422.
Export H.264 for web.

HDV, Exporting, & Burning...

I noticed after exporting a quicktime movie from Final Cut Pro 6, ( without check marking the "make movie self contained), that the movie files are not deinterlaced. I would like to burn these files onto a dvd using iDVD but am wondering if they will still be interlaced once burned or if I need to compress them down and deinterlace. Suggestions? I guess ultimately, what I'd like to know is, what are the best compression settings I should use to import and burn a DVD using HDV footage...
I'm running iDVD 6 by the way.

If your final output is to DVD to be shown on a TV, having interlaced video is normal. Is there a specific reason you want it de-interlaced? That's useful when displaying on a browser viewed on your computer. But if the video is viewed on TV, you want interlaced video. De-interlacing it will actually be counter productive.

HDV export as QT ref movie is an incompatible format in DVDSP

Just in case anyone runs into this:
I have a 15 min. program edited HDV 1080i 60. Sequence setting is set to handle renders as ProRes 422. No prob so far, edits, plays fine. I export as a QT reference movie. Still ok. Try to import into DVDSP and I get an "unable to import, incompatible format" error. Huh? Ok, back to FCP. Now I export QT movie again, this time instead of using the default of >setting >current settings I try Apple ProRes 422 HQ 1080 60i 48Khz. Now it imports into DVDSP.
In FCP audio in the sequence setting is showing up as 32 bit floating point. (can't change this) Source audio is 16 bit integer. It's the only thing I can figure. Ideas?

ref movie both times. It took 2 hours to make the ref movie, I can't imagine how much time a self contained movie would take. I think it's taking so long because I'm using a modified template from Motion in several places.
--Bob

Most compatible format for HDV export to dvd

Hi
I just got a new HDV camera (canon XH-A1) and have shot a project in HDV. I am now mastering it to dvd (using IDvd) and need to know the best format to use for compatibility across tv's (ie SD and widescreen)
I captured as HDV, made a DV PAL sequence. I have found on a friend's SD tv, the footage is clipped, not showing edges, eg the titles (even though in title safe area) and on a friends HDV TV, all the footage appears, the looks stretched?
What is the best format to export my HDV footage, so it is compatible with the widest number of tvs (ie HD ready and older SD tv's)?
regards
Mark

iDVD is not the ideal tool to be doing this with, DVD Studio Pro is better equipped to deal with it, however, if you want to use iDVD, you have to use a more recent version that knows how to handle wide screen (it involves setting a flag so the DVD player knows to letterbox or display widescreen depending on the capability of the tv).
You also need to tell either iDVD or DVDSP that the material is anamorphic widescreen 16:9 material...
Patrick

HDV export compression encoder, settings to burn 16:9 DVD-Rs

What export encoder and settings should I use to simply
burn SD 16:9 DVD-Rs from my Sony HDV 1080i 55 min. FCP HDV sequences in DVD Studio Pro?

Take a look at your preferences options.
You can set encoding rates there.
I really don't know what you are asking about shortcuts to burning.
My suggestion is to read through the manual, and do the tutorials, and then get Martin Sitter's Visual QuickStart book, and memorize it.
Visit here as well.
No shortcuts in creating DVDs. Part art and part science.

HDV exports cause overlayed interlaced frames

Recently we've started shooting with a Canon XH A1 in 1080/50i. We capture as HDV and the footage looks stunning in FCP. But when we export (tried various formats and codecs) the resulting movie have every frame being a combination of its two interlaced frames - not sure if thats the right way to describe it, but the following still shows it pretty well.
http://www.fatsand.com/videos/DoubleFrames_Test_v1still.jpg
The following video shows it too. THe first half is a clip exported normally, the second half is the same clip but de-interlaced in FCP - which works fine.
http://www.fatsand.com/videos/DoubleFrames_Testv1.mov
But I don't want to have to de-interlace all my footage, otherwise I might as well have shot in 25p!
Anyone else have this issue - I can't see what else I can do in FCP, but should I be doing something else during capture or even when filming?
Thanks
Rob
MacPro 2.66, 3Gb RAM Mac OS X (10.4.2) FCP 5.1.2

Recently we've started shooting with a Canon XH A1 in 1080/50i. We capture as HDV and the footage looks stunning in FCP. But when we export (tried various formats and codecs) the resulting movie have every frame being a combination of its two interlaced frames - not sure if thats the right way to describe it, but the following still shows it pretty well.
http://www.fatsand.com/videos/DoubleFrames_Test_v1still.jpg
The following video shows it too. THe first half is a clip exported normally, the second half is the same clip but de-interlaced in FCP - which works fine.
http://www.fatsand.com/videos/DoubleFrames_Testv1.mov
But I don't want to have to de-interlace all my footage, otherwise I might as well have shot in 25p!
Anyone else have this issue - I can't see what else I can do in FCP, but should I be doing something else during capture or even when filming?
Thanks
Rob
MacPro 2.66, 3Gb RAM Mac OS X (10.4.2) FCP 5.1.2

HDV exported as ProRes 422 produces 4:3 in iDVD?

AVCHD exported from FCP X as ProRes 422 works perfectly in iDVD producing a 16:9 DVD.
HDV doesn't, even though QT Player plays it perfectly.
The odd thing is that 4 years ago, using legacy FCP my exported HDV videos had no problems being recognised as 16:9 by iDVD.
So why are FCP X produced HDV videos not recognised as 16:9?
P.S. I know that iDVD never recognised DV in the 16:9 format but it always worked with HDV.
Incidentally, the old trick of opening it in QT Pro and changing the frame size to 1024 x 576 does not work!

The AVCHD was actually 50p footage in a 25p project exported as ProRes via Share>Export Media.
Worked perfectly in iDVD.
The HDV was standard 1440 x 1080 treated just the same and came out as 4:3 in iDVD which I suppose is what it is when the pixels are square.
I have found a workaround/solution.
Make a ProRes 422 custom preset in Compressor specifying a frame size of 1920 x 1080.
Works perfectly and iDVD sees it correctly as 16:9.
Only downside is that converting using the custom preset takes at least twice as long.
Regarding the weird moire pattern when using FCP 7, I have just exported the clips as ProRes 422 1920 x 1080 and they appear normal.
The moire pattern appeared when I exported the clips as native HDV, something I always did years go with no problems.
So I have found workarounds but not solutions.

Near lossless HDV export?

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