Surround Sound Mixing

I am editing a concert and using 4 tracks of audio. 2 tracks come from the live mixing board and 2 come from the mics on the camera. I mixed the 4 audio channels in FCP and it sounds beautiful in stereo. Now I want to make a surround sound mix. I took the mixed audio into Soundtrack Pro and used the surround sound mixer for each channel. Imported back in FCP, burned a DVD, took it home and listened last night and it sounded pretty good but the crowd applause was not loud enough.
I just need to know what the proper way to surround sound a concert would be. Should I do all my mixing in STP? Any help on this issue would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Unlike film, there aren't too many rules when mixing 5.1 or surround in music. I would suggest you get a few concert DVDs or DVD-A or SAC-D music releases and listen to the many different approaches. Some are mostly stereo with ambience in the rear. Some are more what used to be called Quadraphonic, L,R,Ls,Rs, and some are more 5.1 like film with vocal in the C and selected music in L,R,Ls,Rs.
Since you only have stereo and ambience you probably gonna have to stick with the stereo front, ambience rear approach unless you use some upmixing technology. You could also use reverb and delays to create more of a rear channel.

Similar Messages

Surround Sound Mix

I recently got a new computer, and I ported over my sound card, Audigy LS. I got the drivers "OK" and everything, it works. But I use ventrilo, and when I talk on my mic, it's all weird. B4 with the CD I was able to install something like a "Surround Sound Mixer" that had a bunch of different levels that I could change say the volume, or my input and what not, is there a way to download this by itself? Thx for any and all help!Message Edited by smp on 07-28-2005 09:42 PM

If you want to treat left and right separately, like the left channel of your first pair is NOT hard left, then you should make dual mono versions, and then you will get a panner for each, one for the left, and one for the right. But if you want them hard left and right, you can either use the surround panner and put the dot center-forward and center-rearward, or you can assign the tracks to go discreet to outs 1-2 for the front, and 3-4 for the rear. But one dot in the center full forward will give you full stereo in the front. I also use the Quadro setting in the panner, as opposed to the 5.1 with a center channel, assuming of course that there isn't a center channel.

How to Marry Video to Surround Sound Mix?

We're getting a surround sound mix from our post house and we have the choice of .AIFF, AC3, OMF, DAT. How can I take that mix and marry it to the video we have in order to make one MPEG 2 program stream file? And is Compressor the right app for it? Or should I use DVD Studio Pro? I'm reluctant to use DVDSP because we don't need .vob files, just a MPEG 2 video stream.

I have often "married" AIF audio files to MPEG 2 video using only the Quicktime Player App (Pro license needed, though). I take the separate output files from Compressor and open each in Quicktime Player.
Then Select All of the AIF file, copy, then click on the window for the MPEG 2 file and choose "Add to Selection & Scale" from the edit window, then save the MPEG 2 file. You can look at the movie properties of the MPEG2 file to verify that it now has an audio track. You should probably play it all through as well just to be sure it's not out of sync (I've never found that to be the case, though).
Ok, so here are the caveats:
Surround sound typically is an AC3 file and I don't think you can open those in Quicktime.
Even if you can, I think AC3 has a rule about being evenly divisible (or something like that) so it rounds up or down on the time. That could lead to sync problems. The advantage with AIF in using output from Compressor files is, assuming they were exported to the batch correctly, you know they'll be the same time length and thus syncable.
Finally, consider how you are distributing the file if not via DVD. Most people don't have MPEG 2 codecs with their Quicktime player. Even if the movie has a standard .mov extension, they will not be able to open MPEG2 movies with or without sound tracks. To make it playable for the masses you'll need to export the new movie using a more ubiquitous codec.
But, overall, the marriage of MPEG2 and an audio track is easily done as described, above.
Dual 2GHz PowerPC G5, Dual 500MHz PowerPC G4, G3 iBook Mac OS X (10.4)

Ideal Surround Sound Mixing Levels for Music

Hi all,
When using Soundtrack Pro and you mix in Surround sound there are little dots by each speaker and there are more dots for how louder you want the sound to be by that speaker.
My earlier attempts at surround sound have finally worked but the music is so low in the rear speakers that you'd never hear it unless you put your ear to the speaker. Then again I don't want to up it too loud either.
Is there anyone that's familiar with professional audio editing that have any suggestions on typical ideal levels (in dots) by each speaker so that the music really fills the room?

Have you tried posting this question here...
http://discussions.apple.com/forum.jspa?forumID=743
Someone here may have answers, but the STP forum should have some core users with info as well.
K

Surround sound mix, have I got this right (CS6).

OK, done some reading and this is what I think I need to do with my 6 WAV files.
Channel 1 Left - Drag dot in surround pannier to top left.
Channel 2 Right - Drag dot in surround pannier to top right.
Channel 3 Centre - Drag dot in surround pannier to top left (and pan Centre percentage to 100%).
Channel 4 Left Surround - Drag dot in surround pannier to bottom left.
Channel 5 Right Surround - Drag dot in surround pannier to bottom right.
Channel 6 LFE - Drag dot in surround pannier centre (and pan LFE to 0gb).
Unless specified LFE and centre percent infinity db and 0%
Does this sound correct?

Channel 6 LFE - Drag dot in surround pannier centre (and pan LFE to 0gb).
If you do this, there will be output on LFE and Front Left/Front Right, but there only should be output in LFE. If you pan Centre to 100% there will be output on LFE and Centre - that's also wrong. I also don't know how to get output ONLY on LFE!
Besides, this is the right order for your Monos:
1: Left
2: Right
3: Left Surround
4: Right Surround
5: Centre
6. LFE

Critical Surround Sound bug in Logic 8

Unlike many of you I purchased Logic 8 to do surround sound mixing. I liked the fact that it included Sound track Pro. I quickly realized after purchasing it that soundtrack pro had its limitations with regard to doing full audio post for film projects that i am accustomed to doing here in Los Angeles. I turned to Logic as an alternative only to find out that the surround panner is inadequate and somewhat limited when trying to automate it. The issue is that when trying to do a 360 degree pan counter clockwise the node reverses itself clockwise once you cross the 180 degree position in the plane or center of the rear speakers and then continues its counter clockwise 360 degree path. This causes a noticeable stutter in the audio as there is a 1 to 2 millisecond delay that occurs. This also occurs when moving the node from left to right across the rear speakers. I have posted this message to bring attention to this issue in hopes of getting this resolved quickly. I have used many surround sound programs and this is the first time that i have ever encountered this type of problem.

DJWillis wrote:
Since this morphed a little into a Logic vs PT threads as for benefits and drawback, one question always occurs to me when I see any post on surround sound: do you know ANYONE who has a surround sound system in their home who is just a regular consumer, and not a pro audio person testing a mix?
I don't. Surround sound is only for theatrical releases, and it's just small component of seeing a film. No one goes or doesn't go to a movie because it does or doesn't have dolby blah blah surround up the wazoo! Who cares? No one. They just want to see a good movie.
I'm always amazed that this marketing gimmick has had any impact. I mix music in stereo. Period. When I edit movies I edit in stereo. Period. No one has ever asked for surround for delivery. But then again, I won't work for the studios.
Surround sound is like 3-D movies -- pretty silly and extraneous to the entertainment experience. (I just saw "Coraline" last night -- my date and I were underwhelmed. It was nice -- but nothing earth-shattering, and hardly worth the whole 3-D effort.)
Sorry to rant, but it's all just so silly. Going from mono to stereo was awesome I'm sure in its day. Same for going from black & white to color and silent to sound. And from VHS to DVD.
But from stereo to surround? Pass. I'm not stringing up a bunch of speakers around the living room because my life is so boring I need to hear sounds behind me when I'm watching a movie!
Hi DJ,
My next door neighbor has a 7.1 system, and has a few audio-only titles. He wishes there were more.
My uncle, a general contractor, also has a 5.1 system in his home, and mostly watches movies with it. He does have an Eagles concert DVD in surround, and likes it a lot.
When I went to Circuit City, which is going out of business, I asked the pro sound guy what was flying off the shelves, and he stated two things : cameras, and surround theater systems.
As to your statement in red, you should probably become a member of either the NARAS, or the AES, they have both conducted research, with doctors both of physics and medicine, about what is more important, both consciously, and sub-consciously, to a human observer, when viewing a moving picture, both with and without sound.
Both guilds agreed that the sound was more important in judging the realism, and therefore what was believed, than any picture without sound, or an picture with poor sound. The determining factor for when an observer was more involved in the experience always ended up being related to the sound, and it's quality, or lack thereof.
And this research was done a while ago. A nice Canadian fellow has been conducting research on this since 1969 :
http://www.psych.mcgill.ca/labs/auditory/laboratory.html
And his book :
http://www.psych.mcgill.ca/labs/auditory/book.html
Let me know if it's too deep for ya... I'll try to find something a little less technical.
Cheers

Surround sound for A305-S6872

Greetings!
I want to use my computer to send a 5.1 surround sound signal to my Onkyo receiver. I have a headphone jack-sized SPDIF port, which I think allows for surround output.
Additionally, when I tested my Realtek digital output device, the green lights go on but I have no sound (which I'm thinkin' may be a result of the wrong cables I'm using, headphone to RCA).
What do I need and how do I make my computer output surround sound?
Thanks!

Surround sound mixing is done in Soundtrack Pro. FCP isn't capable of surround mixing.
Shane

5.1 Surround Sound monitoring audio interface suggestions

I will be editing some live theatricals for Blue Ray, and want to use 5.1 Surround Sound tracks edited in Sound Track Pro. But I need an Audio Interface to be able to monitor the 6 channels of output in the editing, before I burn the Blu Rays. Does anyone have a manufacturer / model recommendation for an audio interface that will allow me to monitor this surround sound mix on my Mac?
I have speakers, and will need to get an amp, or will one of the Bose systems connect with this inrerface? And I don't need multi-channel input as much as output. I'm a newbie - your advice would be much appreciated.

I use the Focusrite Sapphire for 5.1 surround editing in Soundtrack Pro. Works very well. Very simple to set up and use. Good interface software and they keep updates posted on their website.
For monitors I use the M-Audio LX4's. You can buy them in a surround package with powered woofer. They are small but are good quality. Not sure if they are still made as I got mine a few years ago.
Good luck.
This set up gives me realtime monitoring from SP.

Learning Surround Sound...

Hi,
I will soon be buying Logic Studio. I have never really done much in terms of Surround Sound mixing, but I would like to take full advantage of the Surround Sound capabilities Logic Pro 8 has to offer.
Does anyone know of any good online forums which will be a good learning aid?
Another thing to mention is hardware - I have a Mac Pro, but I currently use the built-in audio interfaces. I presume for the 5.1 output capabilities I would have to get hold of the hardware for it. Any suggestions on where to start for this type of thing? Does not have to be extravagant!
Thanks,
Steve

Hi,
Thanks for the info. Wow, $3K is quite a lot! Is there anything cheaper available? It isn't for pro use, but more for lesiure use. I do stereo mixing for more professional needs, and for that I have my two monitors. But the surround sound mixing would only be for lesiure - and to learn, so they would not have to be super accurate or anything.
I will check out the Dolby website too. What is there available in terms of soundcards that support surround sound? Again, nothing too fancy as I have quite a tight budget to work with!
Thanks,
Steve

Is it possible to add Surround Sound to a quicktime movie?

We've just finished the color correction on a movie we've been working on.
The video is in the Apple Pro Res 422 HQ format with a stereo mix attached.
We also have a 5.1 surround sound mix. (exported as wav print masters)
The problem is we aren't going to layback to tape for another week or so and we've got a
screening scheduled for Tomorrow night in a small theatre with an HD projector.
Is there a way to encode 5.1 to the quicktime file or are
we stuck with our stereo mix for this first screening?
Thanks so much.

I'm not sure what the system is. The screening is being held in a facility that specializes in
post-production sound. (They were the ones who mixed the film)
They have an HD projector (not sure what type) that they use for mixing.
My plan is to have a copy of the movie in Apple Pro Res 422 HQ (1920X1080)
and also compress a back-up version in H.264 in case the system can't handle the bit rate of Pro Res
Technically they should have the ability to open up the Pro Tools session that they used to mix the film and run that audio with picture... but there's a chance the tech people won't be at the screening
leaving me with the owners who aren't as good with the machines.
I was hoping to make it as easy as possible. The stereo mix is already on the pro res file.
Is there a way to add the 5.1?

Very good surround sound question

Some of my instruments I use are in stereo, of course. But when mixing in surround sound, all those different speakers used are actually just outputting mono sounds, which I guess if sounds are placed properly it woud make the sound in stereo, maybe. My question is i this. Say you have a lead vocal on one track and a track with either background vocals or maybe a stereo piano. While panning in surround sound, you pan the lead vocals to the center. You pan the other track to the center, but behind the lead vocals so that it appears that the lead vocals are in front. Since surround sound mixing seems to be the art of playing sounds in positions to be picked up by different mono speakers, will the backgrounds vocals actually seem to be wider than the lead vocals or not? I can not analyze the stereo spread of the background vocals. While i was panning my background vocals and stereo piano in the stereo field, the only thing I have to analyze the stereo image was the Waves PAZ positioner plug-in and the Logic Multimeter plug-in using the Goniometer window. When I move the sound around in the surround sound paning box, there is no change in graphic representavie in either of those two plug-ins. So my guess is that eventhough my back ground vocals and pianos have a much wider stereo field then by lead vocals, I'm guessing that I'm not going to here the wider representaive. Is there a way to analyze surround sound graphically like we do stereo, or am I going to have to split my stereo sound into two mono sounds and pan them wide in the surround sound field. If you don't the answer, write back and say, "I don't know, that's a good one" If you do know, then write back.

jdubz101 wrote:
"So my guess is that eventhough my back ground vocals and pianos have a much wider stereo field then by lead vocals, I'm guessing that I'm not going to here the wider representaive. Is there a way to analyze surround sound graphically like we do stereo, or am I going to have to split my stereo sound into two mono sounds and pan them wide in the surround sound field."
That's certainly one technique you could use if you wanted to preserve the front stereo field only, or if you wanted to move the stereo field to a different angle. When you assign a stereo track to Surround, panned dead center, it feeds the front pair and rear pair equally. But left is still left and right is still right. Unfortunately, when you pan left or right, it's really more of a balance control. As you pan left, the right channel attenuates until it's completely gone when you pan hard left.
Normally, a stereo instrument wouldn't get panned, other than forward or back. Moving a stereo instrument angle left or right by using 2 mono files does work, but wouldn't translate well when downmixed to stereo. Fine for "surround exclusive" recordings. Watch your center channel feed. Any stereo instrument panned hard front will be mixed to mono on the center channel.
If you create audio objects for your outputs in the environment, you can easily see what's going on. Especially if you use a test stereo file with one channel blank.
Regards, Randall

Apac an surround sound - easy one, hopefully...

I'm moments from making my first surround sound mix with Apac, and was wondering in a 5.1 mix which speakers the dialogue tracks should go to? ie just the front Right and Left, or these two plus the center, or all, or what?
Also, I'm reasoning the way to do it is to export to aif the dialogue and Left speaker mix, then export the dialogue with right speaker mix, etc. OR can I simply export just the dialogue, and in Apac place both the dialogue AND left speaker sound (for example) in the left speaker box? Which is the best way to go about this?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thank you!!

From your description, it sounds like you're not working with discrete stems (which a sound designer would give you so that they include the appropriate dialogue, effects, and music for each channel). Instead, it seems like you're exporting 2 channel audio from FCP. (am I right here?)
If that is the case, I'd recommend that you simply create a 2.0 mix in A.pack. (the viewer's playback setup [his/her receiver] can then use it's processing to fill the soundscape). In my experience, if you create a 5.1 mix from a 2 channel mix in FCP, all you end up doing is wasting space (and doubling up audio channels).
Of course, if you do have stems (and all my rambling was based on an incorrect presumption , please detail those a little bit more.

How do you mix music in 5.1 Surround sound

HI all!
I'm fairly new to surround sound but not a complete novice- I know about panning, and the basics of how to use DTS Master Audio Suite, and the standard rules of placing vocals in the front speakers, effects in the surround speakers, etc...
My question is: How do you mix the music in whatever appropriate software whether it's Soundtrack Pro, Logic Pro, DTS Master Audio Suite, etc, so that part of the music filters into the surround speakers?
Disney for example manage to make music surround even when it was originally mono. I'm sure it must be really simple and I'm missing it, but any thoughts anybody?

Yeah, with music you go to the composer and get the multitracks from the studio and remix it in surround. SFX, voices, instruments, everything is an individual item placed in the proper location of the soundfield. You can't take a stereo music track and video shot with the nat sound mic and expect to create a 5.1 mix.

Mixing 5.1 surround sound on MacBook Pro

I've recently connected my MacBook Pro (purchased August 2007) to my DVD player in order to play 5.1 surround sound through the DVD speakers.
This all works fine when I play a DVD on my Mac in surround sound.
However, the main purpose of setting up this connection was so that I could mix surround sound using Soundtrack Pro, and be able to preview the mix whilst mixing. Unfortunately, I've now realised that the Optical Out connection on the MacBook Pro does not support 5.1 mixing and that therefore I am going to need an external surround sound card.
I've read that products such as Griffin Firewave are good solutions to the problem, however, they only exist in America...
I was wondering if anyone knew of any UK products that they could recommend? So far I've only been able to find ones that connect through USB. Would this affect in any way what I am trying to achieve?
Thanks in advance for your help and support.
Harrison

Thanks jgourd,
So what do I need to do to be able to mix in surround sound? So far, the only advice I've had from people (including people at the Regent Street Apple store) is to connect optically to my surround sound speakers. I think, generally, people are confused about MacBook Pro's ability to work with 5.1...
What connection should I be using instead of optical?
By the way, I've found that the Griffin FireWave product I was talking about is available on ebay for a very reasonable price. It plugs into the MacBook Pro by firewire and has 3 3.5mm stereo-mini-jacks outputting 3x2 (= 6) channels line level - so one for L/R, one for C/S and one for LS/RS.
Obviously these need to amplify into 6 speakers. Could I feed these connections to my DVD player? Or would I need to connect directly to a set of speakers?
I appologise if I'm asking stupid questions. But video editing is my "field" - the sound side is something I'm still aiming to get to grips with!
Thanks again for your help =]

What software is available for mixing surround sound on a G4?

I'd like to mix surround sound for a videographer without having to upgrade from a G4 with 10.3.9. All the software (Cubase SX, Nuendo, Logic, etc.) seem to demand OS 10.4. Any ideas out there?
Mac G4 Mac OS X (10.3.9)

FileMaker Pro or its cheaper brother Bento.
There are none better.

Surround Sound Mixing

Similar Messages

Maybe you are looking for