24fps to 25fps project

Hi Im a bit confused.
I have some film clips that are examples of my work and were shot at 24fps. Ive made some qts from
After Effects rendered as 24fps H.264. I realize that IDVD wants the footage to be bought in at 25fps.
Ive tried rendering out of AE at 25fps with frame blending but the results are still not correct. I have a nice dvd project set up for 720x576 in which to put these qts and as this work will most probably be seen on computer monitors surely it doesnt need to be finished at 25fps. What would be the best route to take to get the best quality? The original material is 1920x1080

First off, you need RAM - probably 16GB if you're going to do a full on, real documentary. Please, research on your mobo and see what your RAM options are.
To test whether CS5 will play your JVC files, import one and then click and drag it to the new item button on the bottom of the project panel. you will see the mouse add a '+' button, let go and it will create a sequence based on the clips properties. If it plays, you're good. If it doesn't then you need to find out the specifics of the camera and/or file format that it uses. It's not HDV at that point...
24/25fps is kind of like 220v, 221 - whatever works... ;-) Adobe Premiere Pro CS5 will resolve frame rates, aspect ratios and codecs transparently on the timeline. So, if your timeline is ultimately for PAL, then choose a PAL timeline and throw down the 24fps material as needed, it shouldn't be a problem and will play and output correctly for your destination format.
Finally, I'd suggest you read up on GPU's at Adobe Premiere Pro's page and consider investing in an nvidia Quadro or GeForce card to accelerate your effects and encoding. This has been a bunch of the secret sauce that's made CS5 so successful.
Hope you find this helpful,
Dennis

Similar Messages

Edit 720p 50fps on a 1080p 25fps project problem.

I have an FCP project where most of the footage is 1080p 25fps, but we have some footage that we shot at 720p 50fps, so we can use the slow motion.
Project is 1080p 25fps. All files are in ProRes 422 LT each with its own resolution and framerate, when I put the 720 footage into the timeline, FCP will zoom to fit the window automatically, that's fine, but it will play it at 100% speed, no slow motion. If I reduce the speed to 50%, it does not use all the frames but just one picture per two frames, as if the footage was 1080... so it does not look good at all, just a slowed down clip.
Not sure if I explained it properly, the question is, how can I use the 720p 50 fps footage in a 1080p 25fps project as slow motion?
Thanks!

You have to slow it down BEFORE you bring it into FCP...Use Cinema Tools.
I have a tutorial on this: http://library.creativecow.net/rossshane/slow-motioncinema-tools/1
Shane

Convert 24fps to 25fps

Ok,
I know this is discussed in other posts discuss issues which seem to be close to this, but nothing which seems to quite answer my question. My camera shoots in DVCProHD 720p24, 720p30, 720p60. But I need to export my final project to PAL. I seem to get a lot of jerky motion through motion scenes. Even keyframed photos seem to jerk. I've exported a lot of tests through Compressor with the pre-set for high quality DVD, only changing the NTSC setting to PAL, and seem to get the same jerk regardless of whether I shot in 60fps or 24fps. Even if I put those shots into a standard PAL timeline.
Does anyone have a suggestion for best results when converting either the media for my timeline, or converting my timeline after completion?
Thanks,
Lawrence

Hey G,
A little more testing and I may have something here. I tried exporting the clip from the original 24fps timeline one more time, but this time, I used "Apple ProRes 422 for Progressive Material" from the Advanced Format Conversion>Apple Codecs. I then changed some of the settings as follows:
From the "Encoder" tab, I clicked "Settings" next to "Video" and changed the frame rate to 25fps
From the "Frame Controls" tab, I the frame controls on, and then:
Resize Filter--Better (Linear filter)
Output fields--Progressive
Deinterlace--Better (Motion adaptive)
Rate Conversion--Best (High quality motion comp)
Set Duration to: 24 @ 25
I should have done tests with one setting at a time, but I'm going to try to go back and do more testing tonight. But for now, I must admit that the result is very nice! I then imported my results into my 25fps timeline. This should mean I can just set my frame rate for new psd images to 25fps, and not worry about their motion. For pans or other motion shots that are jumpy, I'll try converting them using these settings.
You might be able to shed more light on what I've done as I don't really understand everything, but I was just sort of experimenting in the dark.
Lawrence

How can I automatically change my edited timeline from 24fps into 25fps?

Hello everyone,
I have a timeline in 24fps with 24fps footage. I have to convert it (the timeline and the footage) into 25fps, so I can put a 25fps Timecode in it (it was a 24fps 16mm film material and it has to be rescan in 25fps...). Is there a way to do that? I mean beside of reedit everything in a 25fps timeline. The footage was quicktime prores 4444, I made merged clips of it and edited it then, so I have only merged clips on the timeline.
I would be very thankful for any suggestions!

Hi Richard, unfortunately I need to burn in Timecode from the source clips, so this won`t help me:/ but thanks for your answer! I think the only possibility for me is to create a new timeline in 25fps, modify the source footage from 24 into 25fps and reedit it. Is there any way to use command match frame (and reversed match frame) from merged clips in a timeline to source material from which I created the merged clips? so the source footage and not the used merged clip will be loaded into the source monitor? it would make a reedit much much faster...

How can I add 24fps to a project set in 30fps?

First, thanks to all who have helped me so far.
Your advice has provided me with an easier experience.
I've shot the main footage in 30fps (29.97) only to find the openind scene was shot in 24fps. *bah!*
Any suggestions?
Thank you again,
Brad

My position is favoring Christian's reply.
The 24fps scene is of 'an old woman telling us of when she was younger...'
This short opening scene will lead us into the main story.
So, in clear response, "yes, I will keep the different look because I personally feel I can use it to create a feeling that clearly distinguishes between the 'past' and 'present'"
Even so. . .
No one has answered my question yet :-P
Do you just throw a 24fps clip into a 30fps project and (different look aside) all goes well?
It didn't seem like that when I did it yesterday. It became jumpy, like the program was pissed off about the whole situation . . .
Anyone know how to solve this poser?
Thanks again

50 fps in a 50 fps project - or 25fps project?

Hi.
My normal working method today is to shoot 50fps 720, then import in a 50fps project. What goes in comes out, basically. I guess shooting in 50fps and then working in the same rate makes the pictures sharper, than simply shooting 25fps and editing in 25...
But.. I need some tips on how to maximize the potensial of my clips. If I shoot in 50fps I do have a lot (2x) more information than a simple 25fps shoot. So would I be better of just editing in 25fps by default? In order to be able to slow down some parts for instance...
I usually don’t use slow mo (as I mainly do ENG). But there are times when I do want to use it, and since it wasn’t planned from the beginning, i did not consider this as I started editing in my regular 50fps project....
Any thoughts, tips and suggestions on this matter would be very much appreciated..
I might add a few more things to think about..
My camera supports 50mbps 50p 720 - but once I go up to 1080 50p is no longer an option, only 25p or 50i (and I have learned to avoid interlacing).

Morphyx wrote:
… I guess shooting in 50fps and then working in the same rate makes the pictures sharper, than simply shooting 25fps and editing in 25...…
I start with a plain "No!" …
'sharpness' is, aside 'glas'/focus/ …, dependent on shutter-speed.
slow shutter-speed = more motion blurr.
Ol' Silverbacks from TinsleTown will tell you the 180°-rule … a 25fps should be recorded with 1/50thsec, a 50fps would be 1/100th sec shutter speed - modern camera techniqués allow all sort-of of aparture, speed, iso, fps. But for sure, you can not apply 1/20th shutter-speed to a 50p recording
Sharpness is part of 'quality', defined by resolution & bitrate, for sure focus, but DoF too (the actual 'look' asks for blurry bavkgrounds). But framerate …?
(compare to the actual debate about HFR in The Hobbit)
sooo, the usual question:
What do you want to accomplish, what 'look', what format?
(motion blurr is a wanted effect for all those 'film look'-afficionados)
'ENG' means TVbroadcast - never heard of any station asking for 50fps material (???) …
How do you deliver, what do your clients ask for?
a 50p delivery is rarely seen on Web video - but demands twice the bandwidth.
50p is perfect, when you do lots of slowmo (sports), but your projects then are 25fps.
otherwise, I see no 'use' for 50p in ENG.-
… My camera supports 50mbps …
excellent specs, … and, e.g. minimum for German broadcasters
If you don't do 'for art's sake' your private projects, I would work in a standard predetermined by your contractees.

24FPS to 25FPS TELECINE WORKFLOW

Hey there -
Just a quick check, If I were to have 24fps Film material telecined to 25fps DV CAM PAL tapes is the correct workflow the following -
1. Import a log file into FCP or Cinema tools and create a new database
2. Create a batch capture list
3. Batch capture the clips
4. Batch conform the 25fps material to 24fps in Cinema Tools
5. Synchronize captured clips with Cinema Tools database
6. Edit in FCP using the Cinema Tools 24fps from DV PAL easy set up
7. Finish Edit and export an EDL for film scan to DPX files
or would this be the correct workflow :
1. Import flx file into FCP
2. Batch capture
3. Conform 25 to 24 in FCP and synch with Cinema Tools
4. Check Lab data in Cinema Tools and correct any errors
5. Edit using the 24 @ 25 Easy Set Up
6. Export EDL or Cut/Pull lists from the Timeline in FCP
Thanks in advance J

Did you read the Cinema Tools manual?
There is a section discussing 24 to 25 TK transfer.
Sorry that I can't help further, I work in PAL but rarely with film. When we do we live with the 4% speed difference. I realize that there is a issue going back to a frame accurate 24fps film cut, it's just that you are asking for something very specific.
Everyone here is a user just like you, so you need the magic combination of people who work in PAL, and deal with 24-25 film transfers on a regular basis. Most folks here are working with NTSC.
Good luck. I hope you find an answer to your question.

FCPX Mixed Frame Rates? 30fps AND 24fps in same project?

Just got done doing a multicam shoot for a large event where I had multiple people helping me out. We all shot at 1080p on a variety of Canon DSLR cameras and a Go Pro and a MiniDV Consumer Cam. I thought everyone got the memo to shoot at 30fps, and most everyone did, however one of my Canon cameras shot at 24fps. I know I've heard in the past mixing frame rates can cause issue in other programs, and I know FCPX can handle multiple frame rates, but what sort of trouble am I in for if I want to use footage from cameras using 30fps and a camera using 24fps in the same final product? Is the 24fps stuff going to choppy or weird if I use it in a 30fps sequence/project? My final deliverable at this point can be 30fps or 24fps, it is not stated and I want to make sure evrything looks good so what should I set my project settings for? Any ideas?

Ah - no - conforming simply resets the frame rate information. You should re-conform it back to 29.97...
Here's what I think you'll need to do. If the majority of your material is at 23.98, make your main sequence that. Cut everything at that 23.98 - you'll have to render any 29.97 material then, but when you've locked picture, look at the sections with 29.97 stuff and if it looks okay, just skip to making the DVD. If it doesn't, you'll have to insert a pulldown by exporting your sequence then bringing the quicktime back in, adding a pulldown with Shake ($500) or Nattress frame rate converter ($99) - OR try this - edit it to tape and a pulldown will be inserted, then recapture.
Once you have a 29.97 version of your clip, cut it into a 29.97 sequence and re-cut in the 29.97 material (now you won't need to render). Then export for your DVD.
Now - after all this, are you sure that your 30fps material is NOT 29.97 with a pulldown? Did you check this yet?
Patrick

Converting 24fps to 25fps, HELP!!!!

Hey! I'd really appricated it if anyone out there could gimme some advice. I'm trying to convert a quicktime rendered out originally from Scratch (grading software) it was rendered out at 24fps and i need to convert it in FCP to a 25fps quicktime, i have rendered it out before but it keeps adding frames to compensate for the time difference, i need it to not do this. I've tried using quicktime convertor and setting it at 25fps there, but everytime i import it back to FCP it tells me that the clip i just rendered is at 24! I've also tried using the export quicktime movie option but no matter what i've tried there it just adds the extra frames. The clip is DVCPRO-PAL.
Please can anyone help me.
Thanks,
Esther.

OK figured it out, converting the clip using cinema tools will give you correct 25 frame rate without the duplicate frames! hurray!!!!

24fps and 25fps on one timeline. Separate sound sync problems?

I'm editing in CS3. Most of the footage is in 25fps. But some in 24fps by accident. I have a way of changing the 24fps footage into 25fps but will this cause problems syncing sound, which was recorded separately?

Well, there's a couple of way, but from what people have said, the easiest way is to increase the duration of the 24fps footage by 4% to bring it to 25fps. Otherwise, people have suggested that some of the newer versions of premiere pro will sort the problem out automatically by matching whatever frame rate to the sequence pre-set.
Also, why is it necessary to match the frame rate of the clips ? Does it affect the editing process or the final product in any way ?

How to convert 25fps Audio to 24fps ???????

Hi,
I hv just finished a music video and convertd it to 24fps from 25fps to make " FILM LIKE LOOK" in After effects.....now the audio seems out of sync and i tried to decrease speed of audio by 4% as i heard somewhere but it didn't work.. is this possible in Adobe..I am using Adobe CS5 Production premium....Or is there any free software in the market to fix this????? m sure m not the 1st havng this problem ...
NEED HELP
Regards

You didn't say how you changed the timing in After Effects. Did you use time stretch? Time remapping? Conforming to a frame rate?
Here's a relevant excerpt from After Effects Help:
"Note: Conforming can change the synchronization of visual footage that has an audio track, because changing the frame rate changes the duration of the video but leaves the audio unchanged. If you want to stretch both audio and video, use the Time Stretch command. (See Time-stretch a layer.)"

Resetting a project from 30fps to 25fps?

I dragged native 30fps clips into a 25fps project and iMovie asked if I wanted to change the project to 30fps, what I did. Then I added native 25fps clips to the project. Now I wanted to reset the whole project to 25fps-can't find a way in iMovie. Any hints?

He meant you need to edit the project property file directly. It works btw, but you need to edit using a good editor such as free Textwrangler and such.
If you feel adventurous right click on your project file in finder and choose "Show package contents...". Find the file named "Project" and edit that. The entry you change is the FrameRate from 30 to 25.

Sync problems with playback, 24/25fps

Trying to make a music video. Footage shot 24fps transferred to beta PAL. I have imported at 25fps and am trying to sync to a CD I was given of the playback that was played on set. The problem is the sync keeps drifting when i play it. In fact it stays in sync for a while and then the picture jumps and it flies out of sync. If I put the play head onto a slate and play it, it stays in sync but if I play it from a few seconds behind it is now out of sync.
If I slow the footage down to 24fps (using the 24@25 function), the sync is fine. Final Cut then puts out a 25fps EDl for the online. So they will have a 25fps project that will no longer sync with the track when they reconform it. What happens?
I have also tried cutting the track at 25fps with the track speeded up to 104% but this doesn't seem to work and as i said before cutting the 25fps to the track as imported but t
very confused

First, thanks a lot for your answers. I think I'll do what you've suggested to me with Logic pro 9.
The only soucy now is: how can I do it with MainStage?
Because there is no "PAUSE BUTTON" in this application. And with my Keyboard AX-1, I was very interested to work Wireless, so if now I have to stay near my computer to un-pause…
If you've got others suggestions?
Thanks for your help.
VEBE

How do you convert DV 30fps to 24fps?

I am trying to capture DV 30FPS NTSC. I can't seem to capture it to another preset of DV Pal or any other preset. I want to know if its possible to convert my footage to 24FPS or 25FPS. Would I use the media manager after capture or is there something I can do during capture?

Capture the footage as shot - you can't convert to PAL on capture.
You can do pretty good standards conversion (post capture) in Compressor, details here:
http://www.macworld.com/2006/02/secrets/marchcreate/index.php?pf=1
I've tested this method and the results are pretty good. Or you could buy the Nattress plugins, which are excellent value.
Don't convert till you're finished your edit, then just convert the master or final sequence.
Remember also that the vast majority of PAL VCRs and DVD players can play NTSC, as can most newish PAL TVs, so you may not strictly need to convert at all.

Film list in Cinema Tools from 25 telecine, edited in a DV PAL-24 sequence

Hello professionals out there in the binary world,
I am looking for 24/25/24 answer to my problem and going thru all the questions like mine with no answer is just depressing !!!
Here is the problem:
We are editing on Final Cut Pro 4 with Cinematools 2.1
16mm shot at 24 FPS with a TC at 25fps to edit at 24fps in FCP 4
Sound recorded at 24FPS (Cantar)imported thru sebskytools...
We edited in a sequence DV PAL-24
(24@25 not available on FCP4)
Sound SEEMS ok as I need everything at 24FPS (quicktime movie, omf and edl)
For the image, I need a cut list for the negative cutter, when I want to make it in FCP4, in the settings, it doesn't allow me to change the TC rate to 25, it's greyed out, I have no choice else than 24...EVEN if I logged the database saying it was a 25fps TC.
In the database it's ok but it's not available in the FCP film list settings.
First weird thing..WHY ???
When the list is done, it says at the beginning and for all the clips used in the edit: "warning, the clip x does not have a telecine speed of 24FPS".... But the keycodes seems ok (same as my timeline)
SECOND PROBLEM:
I also need to tape the movie on beta for that negative cutter and it should be at 25FPS, like the TC otherwise the time won't correspond...HOW ??? Is it possible ?
Thanks for any information you could give me to clear it up a little bet !
All that 24/25 is a little cloudy in my mind, I would be thrilled if someone could blow those clouds away !
Marie
Final Cut Pro 4 / Cinema Tools 2.1 Mac OS X (10.3.1)

Hi Marie
Cloudy.....its a pea souper. Below is a cut and paste of some of the answers I have given in other threads. Also, I would get FCP5 studio as it is much better at all this.
Hi
This is the one area where avid beats FCP. 24fps Pal. I have now used FCP on a couple of PAL features and it is a bit of a pain. I also have the Apple pro support but most of this is all new to them.
Lets start with picture. As you know, you can either make tape/dvds that are the correct running length of the film and include a repeat frame or you can make them playing 4% fast with a pitch change but smooth pictures (1 frame film = 1 frame video). Most of the time, ie. when you are editing you will use the first method and live with the repeat frame. However, for VFX work and the NEG CUT or DI you will need to make 25 frame playouts.
The avid does this well but FCP is a pain.
One work around for the fast output is to export a QT of the cut and use cinema tools to conform it to 25fps. Some neg cutters or Digital labs will work to a QT, if they don't, then the 25fps QT can be imported into a new 25fps pal project so you can make a tape for the neg cutter which has the correct time code and you will have machine control. (Hint, I burn in 25fps TC when I make the QT). The edl will depend on your choice of film key number cut lists or a video edl. Key code lists work well but most neg cutters/labs dont like them. If you need an EDL then it should be made in the main 24@25 project but you need to set the edit code to 25fps before you make the edl. This is changed in the browser by going to TC RATE where it is set to 24@25 speed and right clicking. this gives you the option of changing the edit to 25 or 24 as well as 24@25. Most of the time while I cut, I have the edit set to 24fps not 24@25. Then I can see how long the show is running, how long a clip is etc.
Sound. Most people in the UK get rushes synched at the lab/tk house. They speed up the sound to match the speeded up picture. That blows the idea of an omf unless you are ok with the sound going through an analogue transfer which includes a speed change. If not, you will have to reconform from the original dats.
You must get flex files which will track the original location dat tapes and their time codes. These are used to in Cinema tools to make the batch capture list. When you want to make an edl at the end you will use EXPORT...CINEMA TOOLS AUDIO EDL.
Your audio post house may require a video tape with each reel having time code starting on the hour. That is very tricky and I tend to go back to my avid for that. You can do it by doing a crash record with the added frame and loading that back into a 25fps project. Then making tapes from there as you will now have machine control. Not pretty and quite time consuming. If they will work from QT files its easier.
I think you may have imported the audio which I haven't done in FCP yet. I will try BWAV import one day as they work well on the avid but have been told they don't work well on FCP. If they are working well for you then the omf route should be great. Let me know how you get on with audio.
I have managed to get through PAL features shot at 24 with FCP, but it sure is more work than on an avid, mostly for the assistant editors. However, I like cutting on FCP.
Best

24fps to 25fps project

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