EXPORTING- DV NTSC vs Uncompressed 8-bit

I've been routinely exporting final sequences using the DV NTSC setting (same as my sequence setting). However, I noticed some graphics were coming up flat.
After asking around, someone suggested outputting to Uncompressed 8-Bit and it totally worked.
This leaves me utterly confused though:
- Should I always output to Uncompressed 8-bit ?
- Should I change my sequence and capture settings to Uncompressed 8-Bit?
- Is everything I've done prior not as high a resolution as it could be?
Help- Please!

It depends on how you are exporting to uncompressed.
If you are exporting straight from a DV sequence in FCP, it will most likely use your existing rendered material to create the frames in the uncompressed file. These renders will have had DV compression applied, and possibly compounded if you have filters, motion tab changes, etc.
However, if you export using Compressor (from your sequence in fCP), it will use an uncompressed image buffer for any rendered material, which can avoid compounding the DV compression. This ccan also be a good way to get better results out oof still or clips that have motion applied - By nesting the animated clips into an uncompressed sequence, I can sometimes get better results than by animating the clip right in the DV sequence.
To capture Uncompressed, you'll most likely need a capture card or box such as an AJA Io, Kona, etc. I don't believe that the mac can transcode FW DV to uncompressed on the fly during capture. I use my Io to capture DV material as uncompressed, but there is a digital-analog-digital conversion that happens, as well as a significant shift in color and luma (blacks get pretty crushed).
You also need spacious and fast enough storage to work exclusively with Uncompressed. Uncompressed 8-bit takes up about 90GB per hour, compared to about 13GB per hour of DV.
DV is a compressed format, and a bit lossy, but since DV is generally captured and output digitally, there is no generation loss as such. The only time there is additional loss is when DV material in re-compressed, such as when material is re-rendered. This is the only case in which working in an Uncompressed sequence can offer better results. If you plan to work exclusively in Uncompressed, then caapturing or converting your media will be necessary to make your clips native to your sequence settings and avoid all that rendering.
Keep in mind also that if you are exporting mpeg for DVD with compressor, there should be no difference in exporting a DV sequence directly, or exporting an uncompressed sequence with DV clips in it.
Hope this helps -
Max Average

Similar Messages

Timeline Options with NTSC DV & Uncompresses 8-bit (and others too)

Can someone explain the difference in picture I will see if I have DV and edit it on a NTSC-DV timeline vs. editing DV on an Uncompressed 8-bit timeline? Will it make a big difference after its all said and done and compressed in compressor ready to be put to DVD? What is the deal with all the diff settings within each timeline. Also, If i have edited DV in a NTSC-DV timeline...can I just copy and paste it to another timeline which I have set to a diff setting (i.e. uncompressed 8-bit or DV50 etc.....)?
Hope my question made sense

If you shot DV, what you get is a 720x4380 4:1:1 image. Up rezing or up converting to a larger colorspace will not change that basic fact.
The only time going to a larger colorspace makes sense is if you are doing a great deal of titling/text or special effects. In that case, it may do you some good for composting the effects. It still will not make the basic footage look any better.
If I miss understood, please let me know.
x

Exported dvpal 720by576 file to uncompressed 10 bit

help help help please
i have a client that i edited a 26minute film for,i captured the footage as dv pal 720by576 edited as the same and exported as a quicktime ,current settings .
now the client needs the file sent to the states and has asked for it to be uncompressed ,
can i import the dv pal file and then export that as a uncompressed 10 bit file ,which i have done and there is a noticable difference in quality on my computer monitor.10 bit looks great but the playback is prone to stop&pause
is that because of memory or is there a problem in the process of exporting a dvpal to uncompressed file.
as they want to broadcast this ,which should i do send the dv pal file or the uncompressed 10bit.
any help is appreciated.
cheers
simon

I wouldn't have thought the camera footage would look any different. If you have stills, text or other graphics they will certainly look cleaner if you put them onto an uncompressed timeline. If this is the case then there may be a case for sending an uncompressed file.
As stated by lots of people in lots of posts, the computer monitor is only an approximation of the final output. For a start it is non-interlaced. For critical assessment of image quality you need to be looking at a good quality PAL (in your case) monitor. If you don't have an analogue capture card you aren't going to be able to do a valid comparison between your DV timeline and your Uncompressed timeline. The only way you are going to be able to get an output to your monitor without an analogue capture card is through your firewire, which will take you back to DV anyway.

Is Exporting "None" Compression better than "Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2"?

i am trying to finish my first HD project on FCP. it's a stop-motion film which uses sequences of large jpgs (image size3504 x 2336). I have used the scaling feature in FCP to scale the image to fit into a 1920 x 1080 framing.
when my sequence settings are "Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2", and i export a quicktime with "Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2" compression, i get slight blockiness around some of my edges (near pinks, reds, oranges) that do not appear in the original jpegs. I thought "Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2 meant i was going to get the best image possible, thats what a professional post facility told me to use.
In experimenting, When i Choose "None" Compression for my sequence settings, and i exported the quicktime as "None" Compression, the image is much better and does not have the above blockiness.
Does this make sense?
Is there an aliasing problem with Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2?
Why does it say "Quality:Medium" when exporting Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2 but not give me the option to change that?
If i have to supply a master quicktime for an HD screening, can it be in "None" compression?
answers to any of these questions would be much appreciated.
thanks again,
aj

I'm sure someone who has more experience with codecs will be along soon, but I'll take a crack at it for now.
Using the None option, you're outputting 4:4:4 video, which means there's no color downsampling. When using Uncompressed 4:2:2 the codec is only capable of producing half the color samples of 4:4:4.
Depending on what your source files were originally sampled it, this could explain why you're seeing the degredation. Only very high end videos cameras capture 4:4:4, however. I'm assuming you used a still camera, and I really couldn't tell you what the color sampling is likely to be.
But in most regards, Uncompressed 10-bit 4:2:2 should be extremely high quality. There's an excellent site for comparing codecs here:
http://codecs.onerivermedia.com/ which does report some slight anti-aliasing issues.
Hopefully someone else can offer a solution.
Mac Pro 2.66Ghz - 3GBs RAM - X1900XT Mac OS X (10.4.8)

Trouble exporting with QuickTime 7 to UNCOMPRESSED 10-bit 4:2:2

I have succeeded with shorter videos, but my 90 minute video returns "error -2125".
Somehow I managed to do this before, I'm not sure what has changed on my system. Does anyone else have trouble exporting to Uncompressed 10-bit 4:2:2 ? I'm now exporting to ProRes instead, but would prefer uncompressed video for the sake of quality.

You don't say what's the source of your clips.
If standard DV (..though I doubt that an agency would accept standard def video any more..) NTSC DV is compressed in the camera as 4:1:1, and PAL DV is compressed as 4:2:0 ..so you won't get true 4:2:2 from normal DV, unless you're using a broadcast camera (..probably feeding into the capture device via SDI inputs).
If the source was tape-based HDV or any other hi-def source, then iMovie converts that, during import, into Apple Intermediate Codec, and wouldn't be able to output proper Uncompressed 4:2:2 material.
For Uncompressed 4:2:2, I think you'll need to be using a dedicated capture card - and massive-capacity hard discs! - to be able to import the material in the first place.
iMovie certainly isn't the program to handle pro video of this nature.
Ask in the Final Cut Pro Discussions..
"..I've also tried doing this on my Macbook with Intel processor.." ..but maybe that's just not fast enough (older Mac portables have "shared graphics memory" ..meaning their graphics processor may have to compete with the main processor to temporarily grab free RAM)!

I cannot export to "Uncompressed 10-bit 4:2:2" format. Help!

I need to deliver clips to a stock agency but I cannot export the footage from iMovie with the uncompressed format I need. Not in iMovieHD, nor in iMovie8, nor in FCE. I tried it with a 10 second clip, so it can not be the length or files getting too big!
So what happens?
Exporting to Uncompressed 10-bit 4:2:2
If I try this setting, on all occasions iMovie simply crashes and I get the "iMovie quit unexpectedly" window. The same thing happens in FCE.
Exporting to Uncompressed 8-bit 4:2:2
When I export using this seting, iMovie SEEMS to export the file as it should. But when I open the file in Quicktime, the timebar indicates the full 10 seconds, but the video & audio freezes after about 1 or 2 seconds, the clip keeps playing and I hear & see the last second of the clip again. The same thing happens with files exported with this setting in iMovieHD, iMovie8 and FCE.
I've read on the forum that I should not worry about the quicktime movie not playing right, because the file can be imported into Final Cut without any problems. So I try not to worry about this and hope the stock agency can work with the files... But that still does not explain why I cannot export to 10-bit 4:2:2 without my video programs crashing!
And yes, I've also tried doing this on my Macbook with Intel processor. With the same result.
Can somebody please help me with any suggestions? Thanks!!
Daniëlla

You don't say what's the source of your clips.
If standard DV (..though I doubt that an agency would accept standard def video any more..) NTSC DV is compressed in the camera as 4:1:1, and PAL DV is compressed as 4:2:0 ..so you won't get true 4:2:2 from normal DV, unless you're using a broadcast camera (..probably feeding into the capture device via SDI inputs).
If the source was tape-based HDV or any other hi-def source, then iMovie converts that, during import, into Apple Intermediate Codec, and wouldn't be able to output proper Uncompressed 4:2:2 material.
For Uncompressed 4:2:2, I think you'll need to be using a dedicated capture card - and massive-capacity hard discs! - to be able to import the material in the first place.
iMovie certainly isn't the program to handle pro video of this nature.
Ask in the Final Cut Pro Discussions..
"..I've also tried doing this on my Macbook with Intel processor.." ..but maybe that's just not fast enough (older Mac portables have "shared graphics memory" ..meaning their graphics processor may have to compete with the main processor to temporarily grab free RAM)!

Exporting SD 4:3 to 8 bit uncompressed for DigiBeta

I need to deliver an 8 bit uncompressed file 1920 X1080 of an SD 4:3 18 minute video to a lab for transfer to DigiBeta. The film includes titles, still images, SD and HD video. The DigiBeta will then be delivered to TV station, where they'll take care of readying for broadcast, captioning, etc. I've only done this once before with trial and error, but for Digi Beta theater projection. I had to fiddle with settings to lose some artifacting (cost a couple trips to lab). I thought I took good notes, but not sure if thorough enough.
First, Sequence Settings: NTSC DV/DVCPRO 720X 480 Field Dominance set to "None" (this was the last change the last time that fixed the artifacts that I thought deinterlacing would take care of)
Render YUV
Setting when exporting:
Uncompressed 8-bit, Quality medium (no other option) 1920 x 1080 HD, letterbox checked "preserve aspect ratio, checked deinterlace.
Sound Linear PCM 48 kHz 24 bit stereo, Little Endian checked.
IMac OS 10.5.8 2.4 gHz 4 GB Ram Final Cut Academic 6.0
Need any more information?
I'd like to get this right the first time.
Am I on the right track?
Thanks in advance,
Dennis

Broadcast is about bit-depth and Digibeta is a 10bit 4:2:2 format and supports high bit rate audio. HDcam also has a 10bit 4:2:2 hence why they asked for that too. In lamens terms it means it holds a huge amount of colour information. Imagine a stripe, one side is black and the other pure white and in the middle is grey scale- with 10bit the scale is really smooth, whereas 8bit is noticably chunky in comparison- espeically near the blacks.
DVD is a compressed format and to make the file size fit onto a DVD they basically (in lames terms) strip away parts of the grey/colour scale so that is perceptually like the original, when in fact it is missing lots of the colour/grey range. But the audience won't know, unless they are viewing it on a screen capable of showing the range / resolution. You'll notice the lack of shadow detail in DVD's and if a broadcaster were to use it, it would be extremely blocky, grany saturated etc, because the broadcasters will encode/compress it too so they need the best quality.

File Import Error / distorted image CS3 3.2.0 - Blackmagic Uncompressed 10-bit YUV NTSC 4:3

Hi All-
I have been capturing some old VHS tapes using Blackmagic Media Express via a Decklink HD Extreme 2 card (composite in, RCA audio in) and then subsequently editing the files in Premiere Pro CS3 ver. 3.2.0. But I'm running into a strange problem with the image being very distorted upon import into Premiere.
The capture settings in Blackmagic Media Express are as follows: NTSC, Uncompressed 10-bit YUV, 29.97, drop frame. After capture and before editing in Premiere, I watch the capture file in Windows media player and it looks and sounds fine.
When I create a new Premiere project to edit the clip, I use the following preset: Blackmagic Design, NTSC, 10-bit YUV, 4 x 3.
When I import the .avi file created during the media express capture into the new Premiere project, the image becomes extremely distorted. However, if I choose any other preset in Premiere, the image looks OK, which seems strange because the other presets do not match the import file settings. I should note that when I render the distorted looking file out using the Premiere media encoder, the file looks OK.
Any suggestions? I cannot figure out why the video is not importing or showing correctly in Premiere. Help!
Thanks a bunch,
Rex

Has this process EVER produced non-distorted video when imported into Premiere?
If this is a NEW problem, then what has changed since the process last worked properly?
If this is a FIRST TIME process and problem, my guess is a video driver that is not 100% compatible with what you are doing... you provide no other information, so it could be you need a newer (or, sometimes, older) video driver
Windows updates have been known to cause problems
Work through all of the steps (ideas) listed at http://ppro.wikia.com/wiki/Troubleshooting
If your problem isn't fixed after you follow all of the steps, report back with ALL OF THE DETAILS asked for in the FINALLY section, the questions at the end of the troubleshooting link... most especially the codec used... see Question 1

Exporting uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2 in FCE4

Hello All,
I am experimenting with my SD card and SD card writer on my new 21.5 iMac and I have a question about exporting.
I have a clip of video that is 1 minute and 30 seconds long and when I went to the export menu I clicked on export>using quicktime conversion> and then it gives you several options. I exported the same clip to my HD. I exported the first clip as H.264 and the second time as Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2 Afterwards I looked up the info on the clips and the H.264 clip took up 304.4 MB of space and the Uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2 took up 2.5 GB of space When I played them on my iMac screen the Uncompressed image looked only about 10-15% better than the H.264. Is that normal? I think I remember reading that 4:2:2 only made a big difference for special effects.
My question is: if I export my video as H.264 and "burn" it to an SD card will can I give this to people who have a PC and will they be able to view it in that same quality (as long as they have Quicktime)?
The H.264 that I have "burned" to an SD card looks a lot better than the same video after I have burned it to a DVD in iMovie.
Thanks for your help.
Mike

Hi(Bonjour)!
H.264 is not a production format, it's a delivery one.
Try animation codec for compositing effect outside FCE. Burn data DVD for large file or copy them on external hard drive.
What is you original shooting format?
+My question is: if I export my video as H.264 and "burn" it to an SD card will can I give this to people who have a PC and will they be able to view it in that same quality (as long as they have Quicktime)?+
It should be played on PC side.
Michel Boissonneault

"Uncompressed 10-bit" vs. "None" Compression settings

Hello,
I work at a FX/finishing/color grading facility that provides the final masters for commercials seen on television.
I am trying to gain some insight on the difference between some compression settings, so that I can educate a client on the proper file to provide us.
We have been provided Quicktime files with an "Uncompressed 10-bit NTSC" tag attached to it, though they always come with an FCP wrapper that requires a special codec for us to access the files. They are usually relatively smaller files, which also has us suspecting that they are actually compressed.
We would prefer files with a universal Quicktime codec, such as exporting it with "None" as done in the Quicktime conversion in FCP. Problem being, these files get so huge and unmanageable even when derived from low-end acquisition formats.
A 5 second clip exported with "Uncompressed 10 bit" comes to are 115megs, while "None" is at 457 megs.
Can someone explain to me the differences between these codecs and what causes the vast difference in file sizes?

La diferencia en clara, tú tienes un file uncompressed y otro sin none compresion, paresen igula pero no es así, ambos te dicen sin compresion, pero el none comprsesion es puro, es el file en crudo por esa razon pesa mucho mas, tú tiens que ver que deseas porque ambos se ven bien el resultado en ambos en optimo, ecepto cuando los tienes en FCP y los exportas como DV, ahí se ven la diferencia pues la compresion a DV siempre baja un poco la calidad del producto final.
El file "none" pesa más del doble que el "uncompressed-8bits"
mi recomendacion es depende de lo qué quieres y que capacidad de tu HD estas dispusto a ocupar y par qué trabajo usarlo? será el formato que escojas pero ambos son muy buenos..
pd:puedes contestar en ingles si deseas.. thanks

Uncompressed 8-bit Field Order?

Hello!
In FCP, I'm working with an Uncompressed 8-bit sequence with the field dominance set to "None." After having done a bit of research, I realize that choosing "none" was fruitless since Uncompressed 8-bit is an interlaced format (right?). Anyway, when I export my sequence to a QT file for compression, Compressor sets field dominance to "Upper First." Does that sound right? First of all I've got my sequence set to "none" for field dominance. But if I'm right that Uncompressed 8-bit can't really be set to "none," shouldn't Compressor at least recognize it as "Lower" aka "Bottom First?"
I've read several posts about this but nothing to do with Uncompressed 8-bit specifically, so sorry if this seems like a repeat post.
Thanks for any help!
Cameron

I was looking for some posts concerning interlaced source material and came across this thread. I have to say I don't think it's accurate to say that almost everything other than DV is upper (odd) field dominant. For example, the uncompressed codec AJA uses is lower field first, as well as the Avid codec.
The most important thing is to tell your encoding software what field dominance the SOURCE material is. It can then interpolate and output correctly.
Also, don't judge anything interlacing-related on a computer monitor - look at it on a tv monitor. You won't notice some interlacing problems until you see them output NTSC.
I have had MAJOR problems when importing interlaced source material into Compressor. Number one, it almost always guesses the wrong filed order on import. Number two, at least when bringing in D1 resolution material from Final Cut and cropping in Compressor, the resulting files flicker when played on tv. I actually haven't used compressor - but a great alternative called BitVice by Innobits. It handles interlacing with ease - like it should.
I bring this up because I have never heard anything official from Apple that addresses problems with interlaced source material, and after thinking for a long time that I was missing something, I now realize it's not me - it's them. Try BitVice. It lacks the user interface of Compressor but it's a great (and dependable) encoder.
If anyone can point out posts that address these issues that I've missed, please let me know!
Dual 2 GHz G5 Mac OS X (10.3.7)

720p23.98 and Uncompressed 10-bit with Kona LH don't play together?

FCP 5.1.4
Kona LH 3.4
OS X 10.4.10
QT 7.1.6
I'm at the final stages of my current project which was edited as 720p23.98 DVCProHD, as this is the format that all of the original meterial was shot in. I'm now prepping for a filmout. I'll be delivering a 1280x720 23.976 Uncompresed 10-bit QT to the company doing the filmout.
Here's my issue:
Everything works great and looks fine, however as soon as I switch the video playback in FCP to AJA Kona 720p59.94 10 Bit, playback becomes green snow. I see picture when parked on the timeline, but it won't play out. Switching to 8-bit provides okay playback, but it is a bit shimmery because the sequence compressor is 10-bit. My question is this: Is this just my system, or is it just not possible to get the Kona to play out 720p at 10 bit?
I did a test and I can play out NTSC at 10 bit and 1080i29.97 at 10 bit. It only seems to be 720p that won't play out at 10 bit.
Ideas? Suggestions?

Yes, the rest of the process.
I unrendered everything, switched the compressor for the sequence to Uncompressed 10-bit 4:2:2, changed the video processing to render all in high precision YUV, set motion filtering to best, and rendered. Hit play, green snow to monitor, but proper playback in canvas.
Exported a self contained QT, plays fine in QT player, plays fine for the folks doing the filmout, it just won't play out to my monitor through the Kona LH when FCP playback is set to 10 bit. Actually I have two monitors in the bay right now, one is a Sony Luma showing a downconverted SD signal (via SDI) the other is a Sony BVM-D24E showing the HD signal (via HD-SDI). Both show green snow when playback is set to 10 bit, so I know this is not caused by letting the Kona LH downconvert to SD.

Is uncompressed 8-bit PAL 48 KHz the most compatible format for a HDV dvd

I have shot a project in HDV, edited in HDV sequence. I now want to produce a dvd, that is compatible on both widescreen and 4:3 tv's.
A friend suggested exporting a quicktime movie in uncompressed 8-bit PAL 48 KHz to ensure maximum compatibility.
Would people agree with using this setting?

Mark
There are a boatload of posts on exactly this topic, they come in waves ... nobody will ask this question for a week or two, then it'll be the same question 2 or 3 times a day
Nobody has asked for a week or two so I guess yours signals the start of the next wave! If you use the search function and you'll find the hundreds of answers that have gone before ...
... or just use one of the many tutorials freely available on the subject: for example, http://www.kenstone.net/fcphomepage/hdv_to_sddvd.html
Have fun
Andy

Converting avi. files to 720 x 486 uncompressed 8 bit 4:2:2

I am importing some avi. files into a project that is using uncompressed 8 bit 4:2:2 (720 x 486) material. FCP7 keeps asking me to convert the files using Media Manager. I have many times using my custom compressor settings but the copied files still end up being DV/DVCPRO 720 x 480. What am I doing wrong?

"What am I doing wrong?"
Listening to FCP7? Come on, that's the same lot that told you to export via Compressor...
You should be able to transcode from your source AVIs using Compressor (and your custom settings) without involving FCP at all. Then you should be able to bring the footage in using the Import command. (If your project requires logging there'll be some manual work.)
Media Manager has done many good things for me and several evil things as well. I avoid it.

Uncompressed 8-bit running too fast

Hi all,
I've just been given a project in which , for some reason, the footage has been captured using two settings on two different versions of Final Cut.
The DV-Pal captured footage is fine, but there is also uncompressed 8-bit footage and this plays back too fast. It appears to be a 24fps/25fps problem - when I set it to play back at 24 it's fine.
Is there an easy way to either convert it or set it to play back at the slower speed combined with the other footage at normal speed?
Thanks,
Tom

You can scroll in the browers to find the frame rate of this footage.
PAL needs to be slowed down by 4%. You may want to convert PAL to NTSC in Compressor or look into the Nattress plugins to see if he has an easier solution.
http://www.nattress.com/
Good Luck
Z1

EXPORTING- DV NTSC vs Uncompressed 8-bit

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