RAW+JPEG workflow solution needed

Question to any pro's out there-nitpicky. Aperture 3. I have imported 1000's of files via seperate RAW and JPEG import option into projects, then created a RAW album and a JPG album within each project via a file type filter. I have done this because I want to have the ability to choose to save space by deleting some unwanted RAW files that I know I will never edit, but keep some of those JPEGs. For some I might want to keep RAW and not have the JPEGs. Sounds funny, but the space adds up when shooting 7fps, thousands of 6 MB JPG add up. Here is my question. I have been rating a bunch of the RAW in my RAW album within a project. I have lots of files that I have rejected. Is there a way to automatically match the associated JPEGs of these already rated rejected files that I don't want either RAW or JPEG without doing so manually in the project "parent" folder. HELP! I didn't see this hiccup and I have manually seperated all my projects this way. Is there a better way to do this workflow in the future once I have found a way to straighten this mess out?

Sorry - how thoughtless - here are the steps (pretty much off the top of my head)
-Autostack the RAW JPEG pairs
-Make album of RAWs and album of JPEGS with corresponding file types as album picks
-Go through RAW album w/ stacks closed and label all RAWs to be rejected.
-Go to JPEG album and open all stacks filter by label to pick up the image stacks with JPEGs to keep select all and create new album called KEEP JPEG
-Go to JPEG album filter by label select everything, get rid of filter, invert selection
-Create new album called KEEP RAW
-Go to KEEP RAW album open all stacks filter by file type JPEG, select all, delete images
-Go to KEEP JPEG album open all stacks filter by file type RAW, select all, delete images
I just did that off the top of my head without being in front of Aperture so it might a little wrong but you get the idea. With short cut keys it isn't a huge deal but still too much for me to do on a regular basis to save a couple megabytes.
RB

Similar Messages

Looking for some RAW + JPEG Workflow suggestions

I'm looking for some suggestions on how best to organize my workflow now that I've started shooting with RAW +JPEG. I previously shot only in RAW, but the time spent in post-production was killing me. I've realized that for 95% of my shots that already have the correct exposure, white balance, etc, a JPEG photo is really all I need and saves me a ton of time. I've become convinced that editing every single photo from a shoot in RAW is overkill. I want to have the RAW versions, however, to rescue that occasional great shot where I unfortunately miffed the settings.
Through reading other posts here and experimenting, I've found that Aperture basically defulats to showing me only the imported RAW photos and that I need to click "New Version from Master JPEG" to see the JPEG version. This seems counterintuitive to the workflow I'd like to establish though. (i.e. I'm thinking it would be nice to see only the JPEG versions, and then only bring up the RAW version when the photo needs some serious correction).
I suppose I could highlight the entire batch of imported photos and select "New Version from Master JPEG" and then sort through each RAW/JPEG stack, but I'm still hoping there's a less cumbersome way. Anyone out there have any good workflow suggestions for this issue? I'm curious how other people out there deal with this issue in their workflow.
Thanks in advance!
Message was edited by: Nate Cannon

Try this - I do this as a matter of course:
-select all of the photos after importing them into a project
-create a new album from selection/call it JPG
-with all of the images still selected create new version from master JPEG. all of these should now be the album pick
-close all stacks, the JPEG will be the one showing up on top for that album.
RB
More here: [Aperture RAW+JPG|http://photo.rwboyer.com/2009/01/14/aperture-2-quick-tip-shooting-rawjp g>

RAW+JPEG Workflow issues

When shooting RAW+JPEG Im having trouble finding a good workflow (Canon 5D Mark II, LR 2.2, Windows), whether or not I import with LR treating the RAW and JPEG files as separate photos. (Im drawn to shooting RAW+JPEG as the Mark IIs JPEGs are often very good.)
One major problem with importing RAW and associated JPEG as one unit (i.e., not as separate photos) is what I consider to be a bug: when I export metadata and ratings, they are applied only to the RAW file and not to the JPEG. Is there a setting I havent noticed or an easy workaround?
Also, after importing as one unit, it would be very convenient to be able to separate the RAW+JPEG into separate photos (e.g., for editing and export). Why does the combined vs. separate approach have to be decided on at import time without being able to change it later?
In trying to work around the above problems, I import as separate photos and try to treat each RAW+JPEG pair as a unit. As some have suggested, perhaps the best approach is to create a stack for each RAW+JPEG pair (easy with auto-stack). But this approach is very limited because you cant really treat a stack as a unit, i.e.:
- quickly apply metadata and ratings to a stack
- delete all photos in a stack
- move a stack for sorting and into collections
You can work around these limitations by unstacking each pair and selecting both, but thats a bit clumsy.
Any advice or info would be appreciated.
js

I think I already commented on that in an earlier post.
ACR until quite recently had a very bad habit of bad colors by default... why would I want to create a .jpg from that ugly RAW using LR when they whole purpose of having the .jpg was to have some reference of 'reasonably close to what I'm after.' Or perhaps you needed some quick prints, and don't feel like messing with tweaking colors in RAW at the moment... and camera generated .jpg is 'good enough' with just some simple minor adjustments.
The new profiles are a huge improvement, but at times I still shoot both... just to check up that its still doing what I expect of it. And most of all, I want to use LR to manage ALL my images. Stacks are a handy way to hide the clutter if that's what you want to call it... their functionality just isn't what you'd expect to be there.
Others may have their own reason for wanting to use both. But again... I'm not arrogant enough to presume that everyone should be doing things just as I do, that's the beauty of options - it makes the program more powerful for a wider userbase. If options like this are more difficult to implement than the GND or adjustment brushes... then perhaps some poor initial decisions were made in how they based LR in the first place.
Besides... it wouldn't be as much of a 'hassle' if the proper tools were in LR in the first place. ;)
Plus, aren't there ways to filter so you only see RAW if that's what you are after? I honestly don't know, because I personally don't see the 'duplicate' files as a hassle - though their management could be eased... which I think was the intent of all the suggestions.

RAW + JPEG = ExifTool

Some people have indicated that they want to shoot RAW + Jpeg for a few reasons, principally speed issues.
Running a 'pure' RAW workflow can be very slow (without shooting JPEGs at the same time as the RAW and storing both files on the card), because LR has to Import->build Previews->Export just to get some simple sample JPEGs.
I did a little research, and it turns out that, as we have mentioned before, every RAW file contains at least two JPEG files internally, a large preview and a thumbnail. These images can actually be extracted from the RAW and used for 'quick and dirty' work if you need a fast JPEG workflow.
For a Canon 5D, the large Preview embedded in the RAW is 2496x1664, which is plenty for many uses, such as a quick index.
The tool for extracting embedded JPEG files is called ExifTool, and can be found here:
http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/
It is a 'command line' tool, and is available in both Windows and Mac versions.
The following command will take all the RAW files in a folder and create a subfolder named JPG with all the extracted files inside the new folder:
exiftool -b -PreviewImage -w JPG/%f.jpg -ext CR2 -r .
Notice the "." at the end of the line. It is necessary.
Also notice that it uses CR2 as the RAW file extension, you will need to change that to CRW or NEF or whatever your RAW files are named as for this to work.
I strongly recommend experimenting with some copies of your images in a 'Test' folder, and I am absolutely positively 100% not responsible for anything that happens when you use this tool.
So, it is not for the meek, but if you want to have a mixed RAW+JPEG workflow for some reason, this may be a better solution that shooting both formats to start with.

For Canon users, another option is to use Zoom-browser to batch convert your .CR2 files to .jpg. For me, at least he standard settings seem to match near exactly to how in camera .jpg's appear. You can even use lower compression than camera itself uses.
(I had emailed to Canon awhile back when first shooting RAW asking what settings could be used in DPP to match the .jpg, they said there were none in DPP, but they claimed Zoombrowser comes extremely close since it uses conversion alogrithms more like the Digic chips do.)

Aperture and shooting Raw+Jpeg

In camera Jpeg processing becomes better and better with each generation of cameras. One example is the dynamic range optimizer in my Sony A700. You often have a hard time to get similar results from the Raw. So for quite a lot of shots - especially the not so important ones - using just the Jpegs is a real time saver. Still it is good to have the Raw handy in case the camera processing went in the wrong direction, which still happens occasionally. With 8 or 16 GB cards it is not an issue meanwhile to shoot Raw+Jpeg. Unfortunately IMO there is no smooth Raw+Jpeg workflow within Aperture. Especially it is almost impossible to delete the Raw without loosing the Jpeg and vice versa in a managed library (see thread mentioned below).
Thus I just posted this to www.apple.com/feedback. If you think this is an important issue, that should be added in a future version of Aperture, you might sent your feedback as well:
It is nice, that Aperture already imports both pictures, if you shoot in Raw+Jpeg mode. But the further workflow of dealing with the Raw+Jpeg combo is not optimal:
The main reason to shoot Raw + Jpeg is, to save time in using the ready processed Jpegs for the less important shots or the ones, where the in-camera processing left not much to improve, but still having the safety-net of the Raw for a more advanced development, in case the picture asks for it.
So instead of showing the Raws and hiding the Jpegs by default it should be vice versa. If there is a Jpeg accompanying the Raw, the Jpeg should be displayed and the Raw should be hidden. At least you should be able to set in the preferences, whether you prefer to see the Raw or the Jpeg. If you realize while rating the picture or doing adjustments, that the Jpeg doesn't fit the bill, you should be able to give precedence to the Raw, aka showing the Raw and hiding the Jpeg.
After having finished the work, you should be able to either delete or archive the not used version (either Raw or Jpeg), without loosing any metadata or adjustments already applied to the other version.
Currently it is an extremely complex task, to get rid of the unused version. Workarounds are suggested in this thread: http://www.oreillynet.com/digitalmedia/blog/2007/09/gettingrid_of_unwanted_manage1.html
Peter

SierraDragon wrote:
I am unfamiliar with Sony DSLRs and do not know what might make a Sony JPEG visually equal to a Sony RAW image file.
What I refer to is the dynamic range optimizer, which is based on Apical’s IRIDIX image processing engine. I think it is used in recent Nikons as well, but as I have only a Sony DSLR I mentioned this.
Basically it is a kind of highlights and shadows adjustment, but it works very well and in many cases you have a hard time to generate similar good results with your RAW processor (aka. Aperture).
However, JPEG is still a lossy image format that IMO should only be used for low end usages. RAW converted by the camera vendor's software to non-lossy formats like TIFF should generally be quite superior to JPEG.
Of cause the RAW holds more information and carefully processed often leads to better results than the in-camera JPEGs. But not every picture will be printed in poster size. And although JPEG is a lossy format, with a low compression setting the artifacts are almost undetectable at least with my DSLR.
Shooting in RAW+Jpeg mode can be a real timesaver. You look at the Jpegs firsthand, rate them, make small adjustments, if neccessary. For the majority of the pictures you can use these Jpegs even for slideshows and prints. If you step over a picture, where the in-camera processing went wrong, like oversharpened, oversaturated picture with wrong WB etc., you can easily resort to the accompanying RAW and process it to your heart's content. The only drawback with this workflow is the increased temporary storage capacitiy you need. But with today's low memory card prices, the benefits outweigh the cost by far IMHO.
That said, the reason for my post was not to discuss the benefits of a RAW+Jpeg workflow, but Aperture's issues in dealing with it.
Peter

Need more information regarding RAW JPEG pairs

I understand the importing of RAW+JPEG pair options. What I am having difficulty finding in any forum or user manual is the workflow using such pairs after the import.
If I import a R+J pair with RAW as original, there is an "R" icon in the viewer on that photo. Is the image displayed (version 1) Aperture's rendering of the RAW file? Or is it the JPEG that goes along with it? If I wanted to compare the JPEG to the RAW, how would I do that? If I created a new version from the original and then compared version 1 and version 2, what would I be looking at?

My first question is why are you using a Raw&JPG pair workflow? In my experience it is very rarely needed and adds a lot of complexity to the setup.
Now to answer your questions:
The image displayed in the viewer is always a full resolution interpretation of the current master. If the raw file is the master then the image is based on it. If the JPG is master then the image in the viewer is based on it.
There is no direct way to compare one master to the other master. Only one master can be viewed at a time. However versions made off of one of the masters will always be made off that master.
So if the Raw is the current master and you create a version from it that version is based on the Raw master. Now if you select the JPG to be current master a version is made off of it and the other version you created is still based on the Raw master.
You can prove this to yourself by looking at the filename of each. When you select the version made from the Raw the filename extension will show the Raw extension for your camera. When you select the JPG the filename extension will end in jpg.
So now on to how to compare the images side by side:
For whichever type is the current master select it and do a Photos->New Version from Master. Remember a version made from a master, before any adjustments are made to the version, will be identical to the master.
Now switch masters. A version is created from this master and again as no adjustments were applied to it will look exactly like the master.
These two images are then the Raw and the JPG side-by-side.

Import of RAW+JPEG pairs?

Just when I thought I had it all together...I seem to have forgotten where I put it. I need some expert assistance.
Aperture manages my Library which is kept on an external HD.
I shoot RAW+JPEG on my D200--two image files for every shot. To anticipate the question--I'm learning about the D200, and I want to be able to see the IQ differences between an Aperture-adjusted RAW image and a D200-adjusted jpeg.
I understood that when I imported my image files into Aperture, both files of the pair were imported and saved in my Library. I know I was working with the RAW file for all my adjustments and exports, but I believed that if I wanted that camera-adjusted jpeg, it was available from my Library. I'd also understood that I could call up that camera-adjusted jpeg using Option+J while selecting the paired RAW image in the Viewer. I know I can get a jpeg counterpart to the highlighted RAW image using Option+J--but whether it is generated by Aperture or camera is now uncertain.
Can someone who knows answer the following:
(1) Are both images in the shot pair (.nef and .jpg) imported into Aperture?
(2) If the Option+J image is not the downloaded, camera-produced image--then where does the resulting jpeg file which appears come from, and where are the adjustments for it set?
(3) If my original understanding is correct and both images in the pair were loaded into my Library--why can't I find the paired jpeg? It's not listed with the RAW files in my Finder, and my Spotlight doesn't find it either.
(4) Is there a way to get that paired jpeg into my Library along with its RAW counterpart.
One note on backup workflow: If those paired jpegs aren't imported into the Library, I'm fortunate to have followed advice from some of you here in the forum. Thanks to you, I always download my files using a reader and save them to a folder on my desktop. After importing them into Aperture from that folder, I move them to a folder I use to accumulate a batch for burning to a DVD for archiving. Only when burnt, do I erase them from the desktop and reformat my card. If, in fact, I've been wrong about those paired jpegs being in my Library, then I've still got them on my DVDs. Instead of being redundant with my Vaults, the DVDs will be my only source for them. Thanks to those of you who got me to buy into that workflow.
Terry

Thanks. A little Tough Love from the experts sent me back to try one more time to puzzle through the pages of posts on this subject. Sorry, but there's too much noise and contradiction in those pages of posts for me to buy in.
I did what each of us probably should do--an experiment. I noted the "New Version from Master JPEG" aka Option+J was grayed out if only one of the pair (either .nef or .jpg) was imported. Only having the pair imported activated thet Option+J pick. Excellent, and just what I hoped to see.
I also drilled down to the lowest level of the imported image folders in the Library. I'd previously stopped when I saw the image name but for some reason neglected to open the lowest folder to check for file extensions. Careless on my part. I confirmed what everyone here is regularly assured--that all the imported image files are available in the Library (and Vaults) should Aperture fail, or someone decide to leave Aperture for the dark side. Again, just what I hoped to see.

Lightroom 1.4.1 won't read RAW or RAW+JPEG from Canon Rebel Xsi

I use Windows. I started with LIghtroom 1. Technical support said Lightroom 1.4.1 update would let allow me to import RAW and RAW+JPEG files from Canon Rebel Xsi into Lightroom. I downloaded the update. Lightroom still will not recognize RAW or JPEG+RAW photos taken with my Canon Rebel Xsi. Lightroom will read straight JPEG photos taken with this camera. Any suggestions as to how I can fix this (e.g. be able to import RAW and RAW+JPEG files)? Sorry if there is a simple thing to fix to this or if I could have found the solution somewhere else on this site. I am a Lightroom novice and have been struggling with this issue for some time now. Thanks in Advance.

Thanks everyone for all your help! I am now able to import the RAW files. Steve and Don especially thanks so much! I am posting my solution in case someone out there has had the same problem.
In the past, using the prompt generated from within LR, I downloaded the update and ran the install. However using Don's information I realized the splash screen indicated 1.1 and the number did not match the build # provided by Don.
Based on this information, I went to the Adobe site, reran the download via the Adobe site (not LR) and reran the install. Of note, this install process gave different screens from when I ran install from the files downloaded accessed via the LR prompt. The biggest difference is that this time I got Adobe directions for how to execute the update. I next confirmed that I had the update files on the hard drive, opened the file as directed by Adobe and the install updated. However I was still getting the LR 1.1 splash screen.
Based on information posted elsewhere, I determined that I needed to delete the LR icon from my desktop. I moved "LR 1.4.1" from the start menu to the desktop. I now launch LR 1.4.1 when I hit the LR icon and I have successfully downloaded a boatload of RAW files. Thanks All! You are geniuses!

Exporting RAW masters of RAW-JPEG Pairs

Is there any way to export only the RAW master of a RAW-JPEG pair? I always shoot both RAW and JPEG. In my workflow, I first import into Aperture the JPEG's. I then group into stacks, choose my stack picks, and finally rate all my stack picks. I then will go back and only import those RAW files which match my stack picks. Occasionally, I would like to edit my RAW files outside of Aperture using Capture NX2 and would like to export only those RAW files. Exporting a "version" only allows to export a JPEG/TIFF or other file. Exporting "masters" exports both master files, the JPEG and the RAW. Is there a way to only export the RAW master?
Thanks for your advice.

I'm frustating about how Aperture give RAW+jpg pairs and once imported is not easy to select one of the two files depending on the case. I read recently a good solution, you can import Both as masters(RAW and JPG) and select AutoStack(⌥⌘A)
with a short time span (0:02) and Aperture will import the two masters of each photo, and later you'll be free to use one of them. And you can reject manually all the RAWs that you don't want to store.

Import Avi's in A3 missing if I don't choose RAW+JPEG

If I choose to import only RAW or JPEG in A3, then none of my cameras AVI's show up in the window for import. If I choose either RAW+JPEG (RAW master) or RAW+JPEG (JPEG Master), then the AVI's show up and I can import them.
Has anyone else experienced this? Am I doing something wrong?
I'm shooting with a D90 (in RAW and JPEG) if it makes a difference.

There's a bit to learn. It will slowly make sense.
Aperture is an empty field. You're given a tractor and a whole bunch of attachments. What you grow, how, and where, is entirely up to you.
Vaults are for back-up and only for back-up. They have nothing to do with storing your working files.
When your Library outgrows your system drive (and for good performance, you should leave c. 20% of every drive empty), it's time to convert some of your image's Masters from Managed to Referenced. ("Managed" and "Referenced" refer to Masters, not to Libraries.)
There are hundreds of posts in the forum, and several pages in the User Manual on using Masters.
Many people run Aperture with the Library on their system disk, and most (or all) of their images' Masters on external FW drives. This is a good set-up. Note that you will likely have to take steps to back-up the data on your external drives.
If you do the above, there should be no reason to delete any Projects.
The choice of RAW or RAW+JPEG or JPEG depends on the kind of work you are doing. I capture RAW only -- but I don't do any commercial shoots. Pros on deadlines report that the RAW+JPEG works well for them. Capture JPEG if it saves you time. IMHO, there is not a good reason to shoot JPEG to save space (space is cheap; time expensive).
Short-term solution: buy and use a FW800 external 1 TB drive, formatted "Mac OS Extended (Journaled)", and using Aperture relocate the Masters of all images older than 30 days to that drive. (Be sure to change your back-up strategy to include this new drive; you may need a second new drive.)
This general post of mine might help you understand more about Aperture.

Not importing JPEGs in case of "RAW+JPEGs" files

When I import "Raws+Jpegs" from me card in to Lightroom, can I avoid importing ther JPEG's that come with the Raws, and for which I have no need?

Jimburgess suggests the following options for avoiding/eliminating JPEGs from RAW/JPEGs:
1) The obvious way to avoid importing them is to set your camera to produce RAW files only, if it's capable of doing that. I JUST PURCHASED THE SONY A700 AND I DON'T KNOW WHETHER ZOOMING ON ITS LCD WILL BE POSSIBLE WHEN I SHOOT IN RAW ONLY? IF YES? THIS WOULD SOLVE THE PROBLEM.
2)Copy your images from the card to the hard disk, delete the JPEGs, then do the LR import of the RAW files AND 2) Make sure "Treat JPEG files..." is checked in LR preferences, import the RAW + JPEGs, then delete the JPEGs from LR and the disk, isolating them using filter on file type or sort by filetype.
I AIM AT IMPORTING MY RAWs IN LR IN A STRAITHFORWARD SIMPLE WAY: DIRECTLY FROM CARD INTO LR, WITH DNG CONVERSION AND BACK UP TO EXT. HD. SOLUTIONS 2&3 ARE TOO LABOUR INTENSIVE AND CAN CAUSE ALL KINDS OF MISTAKES.

I am having issues when I shoot raw + jpeg. Raw files seem corrupt!!

I am having issues when I shoot raw + jpeg. It seems the raw files get corrupted. I have shot raw without an issue. It is only when I shoot raw + jpeg. The raw files will not show in Photoshop elements. I installed the Canon software and was able to see all the raw files; however, I noticed that when I tried to view some full screen they would not show. I also noticed that these raw files look block-ish. They appear more digital looking. Is there a specail card needed to shoot raw + jpeg? I formatted the ones that I have prior to using them.
Solved!
Go to Solution.

While it could certainly be a card-reader problem, data corruption of any kind can be any of the following:
1) the card
2) the cable (if used)
3) the card reader (if used)
4) the computer RAM,
5) thecomputer hard drive (or SSD)
A failure of any one of the above will result in corrupted images when viewed. Since it seems to be RAW file related, as they are signifantly larger than JPGs, it's likely anything but the card reader or cable.
The only way to 'beat it' is eliminate each of the possibilities, starting with the easiest/cheapest fix.
1) Use the cable. If that solves the problem, replace the card reader.
2) Use a different card. If that solves it, toss the old card.
3) If multiple sticks of internal computer RAM, swap them. If that fixes it, or, the problem 'moves' to other images, replace the RAM. It could be only 1 of 2 sticks bad, though, so use only 1 of the old sticks for a while to see if the problem recurs.
4) If you have multiple hard drives in your computer, or an external one, use that to store the photos for a while. If the problems go away, it's the drive. Note that hard drive failures typically start slowly and increase gradually. On occassion, though, your computer won't boot and it's all over. If you are down to thinking it's the hard drive, it's time to get a good backup...NOW!
For what it's worth, I had a similar problem with corrupted photos. Both RAW and JPGs were affected. But as the problems were after having loaded and initially viewed them on my HD, I knew it was a computer problem. It dogged me for a couple of weeks. I even played swap the memory sticks, pull one out and run on one only, swap the one for the other (running on one), and it STILL kept happening. I finally gave up and replaced both sticks of RAM. That solved the problem. So much for lifetime warranty from Hong Kong. A very well regarded brand of RAM, no less. My SSD drive was the next one on the list, it the new RAM didn't solve it.

RAW+Jpeg Thumbnail Viewing Problems

A bit confusing...
I shoot RAW+Jpeg. My Jpeg's are B&W by in-camera choice, I have a Canon 5D w/ Picture Styles.
I import into Aperture from the CF card. It shows only the RAW pix, as it should.
When I browse the Project folder for these new pictures, select them, and choose New Version From Master JPEG, the Jpeg's come in stacked with their RAW counterparts, and they appear in thumbnail not as B&W but same as RAW color converted. If I unstack, there is no change of the Jpeg to B&W. If I view the Jpeg in the Viewer, finally I see it as B&W. This doesn't work for me. I want the B&W thumbnail.
On the other hand. If I have set these pix in an album, and then select New Version From Master JPEG while in that album, the Jpegs come in individually, showing as B&W....BUT.... since they are in the Album and not the Project, they are not represented in the Project folder, and any Keywording that I may have done in the Album is unsearchable. So I essentially get the view that I want of the thumbnail but Aperture doesn't really know it's there.
To make matters worse, an earlier Project that I drew the Jpegs into does seem to show the Jpeg thumbnail stacked with the RAW, and in B&W as desired. I can't remember if the B&W thumbnails came in that way at first of Aperture finally got around to properly representing them as such at a later launching.
I have been encountering some frustrating inconsistency with this application, and am getting very very tired of not just being able to use it without having to track down why it's not operating properly every time I import.
I still don't know why the Library 5-star smart folder only shows the same small portion of select pics, when I have continued to add many more 5 star ratings in subsequent Project folders.
My Referenced image folders, and my vaults, have been very secure.
.......todd

Hey Karen,
Thanks for coming in on this, you were very helpful w/ directing me to bringing up the Jpegs from behind the RAWs with New Version from Master JPEG in one of my other queries.
I want to reference your comments as paragraphs 1), 2), 3), 4), if I might, so as to shorten the text here:
1) My images are in a Project folder, from there I created an Album.
While in the Album I selected all the images, and clicked on New Version from Master JPEG. The JPEGs came in seperately, i.e. not stacked with the RAWs, and the thumbnail appearance was B&W, which is what I was hoping for.
I Keyworded all the images in the Album, and then for kicks and confirmation, I tested the keywords in a search, my search was totally baffling.
When I searched for my "B&W" keyword, only the color Raws came forward, why? I don't know, there was no such keyword used on these images.
Also, I discovered that none of the JPEG's were showing up in the Project folder.
Next, I decided to select the RAW pictures in the Project folder. I then applied New Version from Master JPEG, and the Jpegs came up stacked with the RAWs.These JPEGs showed now in both the Project folder and the Album. But the problem for me was that both the RAW and JPEG were in color, identical to each other.
When I unstacked these stacks and Keyworded either in the Project or Album folders, indeed, they were searchable. But mind you, no thumbnail was to be seen that was B&W in appearance, and this was unacceptable, I count on being able to see the B&W thumbnail.
And, more confusingly, other earlier Albums have not all had the same problems with bringing in B&W thumbnails.
2) The smart album that I'm refering to here is the Library root select folder that has the 5 stars. It should have no problem collecting my 5 star images, wherever they are. Or so I thought. But quite a few 5 star images were not making it into this smart folder.
But now, since your writing, I went into a couple of Projects and had to manipulate the images to appear, which they finally did in both the smart folder in a Project, as well as the root "Select" folder in the Library. So now they show up in both places as they should. The solution was to make sure that the 5-star image was the Pick of a stack for it to show up in a "select" smart folder. I'm a little disappointed that stack internals seem to escape the search. I think this problem needs to be remedied. Until then, I guess I have to just be more diligent.
3) Thank you, I'll hit this link a little later, I have paid some attention to this site, it's been really helpful.
4) I did go to this site, unfortunately nothing here has helped my problem with the Jpegs.
.......todd

Importing RAW+JPEG then deleting JPEG later?

I shoot RAW+JPEG, primarily because I can upload the JPEGs easily for family to see (lots of pictures of our toddler) and I can keep the RAWs around for more involved editing. Importing as RAW+JPEG w/ JPEGs as masters is great since I can tag, rate, etc before uploading, but once I've got the JPEGs online, I really have no need for them. So...
*What's the best way to get rid of JPEG masters (and obviously change the RAWs to masters) after I'm finished with them?*

Nikon, in its infinite wisdom, has elected not to share the encoding methods for any of its sensor data with third-party software companies, with the exception of white balance. As a result, the "first look" at any Nikon RAW file that's not opened in their own software is pretty bad (presets make it better, but still tend to fall short). That's not to say Nikon software is required to make a RAW look gorgeous, but the default rendering by Nikon software is pretty darn amazing given the complete lack of work needed. Since the JPEG's use these defaults, they're equally amazing. On the other hand, shooting RAW then exporting to JPEG in Aperture means vastly inferior shots "out of the box" since aperture can't decode anything but white balance. I could certainly make them better, but I really just want an "OK Mom, here're pictures of your grandson" solution that requires no additional time at the computer for me. Since the JPEGs are "perfect" to begin with, begin able to tag the photos, upload the JPEGs with keywords, etc intact, then delete them and save the RAWs for more involved work later, is ideal.
*So, how do I import RAW+JPEG and later delete the JPEGs and make the RAWs the new masters?*

RAW + JPEG Quality setting. Canon 5DII. 2 JPEGs downloads.

I am using PSE 7. ACR 5.6 installed. Camera is set for RAW+JPEG but download is only 2 JPEGS. I have read the plug-in download and install instructions several times and all that I am able to think of is ACR need to be installed in two locations.
Now what?
Bob AZ

Barbara
Thanks for the very helpful reply. I have been using Canon since 2005 and all has really been well. I could comment further but it would be thread drifting
I usually shoot only RAW and many images at a time. 250+. Sometimes I would like RAW files/images and JPEGs of each image. Usually maybe three times a year. This last time I was doing 50 some portraits with RAW for portraits and JPEGS for a directory. Imagine my surprise when the download was all JPEGS. I usually download from my Canon, a 5DII now, using My Computer with no problems. Been doing it since day one. Never a problem. Reshoot would have been a real inconvenience for lots of folks. I had recently sent my camera and lenses in for maintenance and have the lenses calibrated to the body. First thought was the camera Firmware Update so I checked the Adobe Camera Raw site for updates and updated ACW to 5.6. Three times I tried it to no avail. Nothing I tried would work. I did stumble through the portraits with acceptable success but I am a firm believer in RAW so in my quest for a solution I tried the Canon Forum and now the Adobe Forum. I also did pull the CompactFlash card from the camera and verified that both RAW and JPEG files are on the card using My Computer.
Which Windows System Utility do you suggest?
Bob AZ

RAW+JPEG workflow solution needed

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