Help - monitor calibration-color management disaster!

I'm hoping someone can help me with this problem that is driving me nuts. I'm trying to get my monitor calibrated so that what I see on the screen, in terms of color hue/tint/saturation and overall brightness, is what I get out of the printer when I print a photograph. Right now, what I see on my screen has no relationship to what comes out of my printer. In order to get one decent print, I'm having to print 3 or 4 test runs to adjust color, brightness, saturation and balance. It's ridiculously time-consuming and wasteful of paper and ink. There has to be a better way.
Here's my situation: I have Photoshop Elements 8, and am running it on Windows 7 OS. I have a ViewSonic flat screen monitor and an Epson r1900 printer that is dedicated to photographs only. I've bought and installed HueyPro to calibrate the monitor, but the results were not good. After installing HueyPro and running the calibration, the results it gave me are useless for both viewing the monitor and printing pictures. There is an obvious blue cast to the monitor screen image, and the oranges and reds are oversaturated and neon bright. The image on the screen looks like the dog's dinner. When I try to print with that screen profile, the pictures are overly dark, and the skin tones have a grayish and bluish cast that makes them look like the work of a beginning embalmer. I have PE8 set to always optimize for print and my camera is set to Adobe color management.
In order to adjust, I've turned the HueyPro calibration off. For every picture I want to print, I have to open it in RAW, select the Vivid or #3 calibration, max out the fill shadows and adjust the exposure. Then, I save it to Photoshop, where I use layer-screen to lighten the picture - sometimes twice. What I see on my screen is a washed out, faded image that looks horrible in every respect. But, when I print it, I get a good if not great picture with decent brightness and colors.
I'd rate my results as a C - maybe a B- on a very good day. That's after all of the jiggling and tweaking. Before, the results are an F, but only because that's the lowest score possible. This can't be the best that is possible. There has to be something out there that I'm not doing right, or something that I'm not doing at all. I'll take any and all help/advice.

Would that cause the disconnect between what I see on my screen and what the printer produces?
It should not.
Is either PE8 or the printer the better option, or does it matter?
I would experiment with both. As long as it is just one of them at a time. Good luck!
Juergen

Similar Messages

Accurate proof with inaccurate monitor? [color management question]

At the risk of sounding really dumb, here goes:
I have never had a true color managed workflow despite dabbling in it and even delving into custom profiling.
I don't want to shut the windows in my upstairs office and be dependent on unnatural light sources. I'm content to design knowing that what's on my monitor is not accurate.
But I do want to be able to print my own inkjet proofs and know that what I see on paper is at least 90% accurate to what I'll get off press. And I want to try my best to provide clients with PDF proofs that come as close as possible to press. (This last bit's probably a pipe dream given that the clients don't have calibrated monitors, but perhaps Acrobat 9's new Overprint Preview default settings will help somewhat?)
Is this realistic? Everything I know about color management starts with monitor calibration and I'm reluctant to take that step for fear of working in a cave-like environment.
Would love to hear thoughts from the community.

I'm still using my Sony Artisan, and dreading the day it fails to calibrate, but I'm definitely in the minority now. Adobe Gamma is useless for LCDs, and no longer ships, but the modern hardwares solutions are all supposed to be compatible. I suspect you'll get good results with a good monitor.
As far as being worthwhile, absolutely. My office uses North light and daylight balanced fluorescent lighting, so there isn't a harsh color change through the day. Things are probably most accurate at the time of day when the calibration was last done, but they are definitely better any time than they would be without it.
Peter

Best monitors for color management

Wanting to buy a monitor that will display the RGB COLOR profile

There are many wide gamut monitors on the market which will natively reproduce most of Adobe RGB (I assume that's what you mean by "RGB").
But I wouldn't recommend that unless you are fully aware of the implications. Such a monitor can only be used in a fully color managed environment, and it must be calibrated and profiled to perform as intended. Without full color management there's no way it will display correctly and it's just a waste.
Taken at face value (what is the "best"), your question only has one answer: Either an NEC PA series, or an Eizo CG/CX series. They are expensive, but worth it. If you're on a tight budget, go down in size, not quality. Panel size is the single biggest cost factor and a good 24" is way better than a mediocre 27" or 30" at the same price point.

Photoshop Help | Printing with color management in Photoshop CS6

This question was posted in response to the following article: http://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/using/printing-color-management-photoshop1.html

This is usually done in the printer driver's console.
What make/model printer do you have?
Good luck,
Hunt

Need help in Disabling Color Management prior to Printing

I have PSE 10 on my MAC and need to find out how to disable color management in the printer preference catalog. Can't seem to find it.....

Click the "More Options" button at the bottom.
Select "Color Management" from the left side.
Change the Color Handling setting as desired.

Help setting up color management profiles on mac

I've downloaded the lasted drivers for my Canon MP620 printer, and installed them. But when I go to color management in the print module and click on managed by printer and then select others, the Canon drivers are not there. Wondering if I'm missing a step here for getting the Canon profiles to the right place. I'm using mac os 10.6
Thanks

gme109 wrote:
I've downloaded the lasted drivers for my Canon MP620 printer, and installed them. But when I go to color management in the print module and click on managed by printer and then select others, the Canon drivers are not there. Wondering if I'm missing a step here for getting the Canon profiles to the right place. I'm using mac os 10.6
Thanks
From my little experience with Canon 'multi' printers, I would forget printing out of Lightroom with anything other than Managed by Printer. The Others you mention are profiles necessary for allowing Lightroom to manage the printing. I've set up two Canon multi models (MX860 & MP560). Neither managed to produce decent prints using Managed by Lightroom - largely because of the way that the Canon driver controls are configured. I talked at length with Canon (UK) about a work around, but in the end they gave up. That's the downside. The upside is that both printers produced great quality prints using the Solution Menu software that comes with the printers.
Unless, of course, someone knows better.

Color Management Confusion-Photoshop and monitors

Ok, so I am asking this question because I am literally at my wits end with this color management stuff. I have become so confused in the past few days that I can’t even think straight. Anyway, I am hoping you all can help me “understand” how it all work. Let me start with some background information (since I know it will probably be asked)
am a photographer, I utilize Lightroom 4 and CS3 (I know its old but I am planning on getting CS6 soon).
put my pictures on the web that I will assume will be viewed on multiple different browsers.
also will be sending my pictures to print at mpix or whcc. I may decide to print my own but haven’t really made that determination at this point.
have a mac book pro that I work from.
Ok, so I need to get a monitor to work with but I am unsure if I should just buy the thunderbolt mac monitor or get a wide gamut monitor. I have heard so many people say that the wide gamut monitors just messed them up. Also, I am bit confused on the nature of monitor profiles and how they work with photoshop and lightroom. I would assume the monitor applies a profile at all times? I also don’t understand the existence of the prophoto and wide gamut profiles for the mac monitors… they clearly are not wide-gamut monitors, so how do these profiles exist for them, and why would they be useful (if you set the profile to prophoto for example, it is all washed out as expected). Are these profiles “assigning” a profile to the color? I am assuming so because if they were converting them to just a standard rgb then you wouldn’t have the faded colors (correct?).
I just am so nervous that I am going to create something that looks great in Lightroom or Photoshop but that looks awful on the browser, or worse, on a different monitor (standard monitor) and I would have no idea that it looked bad. Or, if I send something to a printer only to get a mess back.
Also, please let me know if I correct in this. If I am in photoshop and I have an untagged image (send via a friend), and lets just say it is really a prophoto image (although my friend didn’t tell me) and I say to assign the prophoto profile (upon import to photoshop). If that truly is the correct profile, the image should look correct. Now consider two scenarios from there: 1) I embed that profile in the image, if I upload that to the web (I know to be cautious, you should always use srgb for web), if the person has a color managed browser, the image would properly appear, because the browser would recognize the profile (in this case “prophoto”) and convert it to whatever it needed to be. But, if it was not a color managed browser, I run the risk that the web browser will just assign a profile, which will wash the photo out most likely, correct? Ok… and scenario 2) after I get the image from my friend and assign the prophoto profile (since that is the correct profile the image was actually created in, although it was untagged when it was sent to me), the image will look correct… BUT, is photoshop displaying the prophoto profile, or is it converting to RGB for my viewing, or is my monitor converting it to rgb for my viewing? I guess I just don’t understand how the monitor fits into all of this. You HAVE to use your monitor to see your images, and since most monitors (including my current one are standard gamut) it would make sense that you actually can’t see anything in the prophoto profile, and you are truly looking at an srgb profile since that is all your monitor can display.
Oh ya, and what benefit is the color match rgb? It seems everyone speaks of the srgb, prophoto, and argb.. but never some of the others.. so maybe I am just lost. I would even appreciate a link to some tutorials if you think those would be helpful.
I am seriously confused.. I would really appreciate the help.

I am not surprised you are confused about colour management because its a confusing subject. Luckily you own a Mac so you can get to grips with what the problems that colour management solves using the "colorSync Utility" and you will find this in Applications >> Utilities >> colorSync Utility. If you own a windows computer then I am sorry but you will be out of luck here and you should know better when you buy your next computer!! I am not sure why Apple gave us this application but it is really useful and all will help you understand Color Management.
1. Launch Applications >> Utilities >> ColorSync Utility.
2. You will see a list of "Installed ColorSync Profiles". Choose Adobe RGB 1998 which I hope you have chosen in you camera preferences.
3.You will see a 3D representation of the Adobe 1998 Colour space. This represents all the colors this colour space will hold.
4. Top left hand corner you will see a little arrow pointing down next to "Lab Plot". Click on this and a drop down menu will appear.
Choose "Hold For Comparison"
5. Now somewhere in the "Installed ColorSync Profiles" list you will find the profile for you monitor. Choose this.
6. You will now see a new colour space inside the Adobe 1998 Colour space. If you have a cheap monitor the colour space will be small
inside the Adobe 1998 profile. This means that you monitor cannot show you all the colors that are missing.
7. Now choose a printer profile say, if you use them a profile for an Epson paper or any printer profile you have and you will see another profile in the Adobe 1998 box which shows you the only colors that your printer can print. If you like choose your monitor profile then hold for comparison then the printer profile and it will clearly show the mis match between you monitor and printer.
8. Now choose SRGB and this will show you what colors a person using an average Windows monitor can see, poor people.
So this is the problem, all devises can reproduce only a certain range of colors. The adobe 1998 profile does not show all the colors our eyes can see " choose Generic Lab" profile, then "hold for comparison" then Adobe 1998 and you will see Adobe 1998 is a small profile but is a good average of our collective colour vision.
So how to solve all these missing colour problems. Well if you think of each devise, including you camera as speaking a different language from you monitor and printer then it is easy to understand that you need some sort of translator so that they all know exactly what colour is being talked bout pixel by pixel in an image. This is held in the ICC profile, but an ICC profile has o do more than this.
Say you camera can produce a specific red we will call for demo purposes "001" and your monitor cannot produce it, how do you solve this? Well it is very easy to fool our eyes. Our eyes work by comparison so if the profile maps red "001 to the nearest red that the monitor can show and then proportionally remaps all other reds to fit within the reds the monitor can show us then we actually think we are seeing a full range of reds. The problem comes if we use the wrong profile for this. The red 001 could be re mapped anywhere and could be outside what the monitor can show. Say that happens but the printer can reproduce that red 001. We would see an image on the monitor with not many reds and when we printed it we would be shocked to find reds on the print. Worst, we would see an image on the monitor without reds and would correct for this and end up with a print with heavy reds and would not be able to work out why.
So to solve this we should:
1. use the correct camera profile when we are opening "Raw" files.
2. Make sure you have the correct monitor ICC profile selected in "System Preferences" >> Displays.
3. In photoshop we should make sure that the " Edit >> colour settings " are set to Adobe 1998 for RGB.
4. If you are going to print you own photo in Photoshop go to "View >> Proof Setup >> Custom" and a box will
open. Choose the profile of your printer and paper and choose "Perceptual" for rendering intent and then " OK". If you cannot find
a profile for you printer and paper go to the printer of paper manufactures web site and download the profiles and instal
them.
5. You can now adjust the colors and contrast and photoshop will simulate how the output devise will deal with this. If you
are using an outside printing house, they will supply you with their ICC profile to download so just follow the same procedure and
choose their ICC profile and and do you colour correction.
If you have a cheap monitor you will still not get a 100% result but you will get closer. You really need a monitor that you can calibrate
regularly because generic ICC profiles are just that. They are made from the results of many monitors and so are 90% or worse accurate.
If you want to see a flag ship monitor at work go to http://www.eizo.com/global/support/db/products/software/CG223W#tab02 and go
to the bottom of the page and download the Eizo Coloredge CG223W monitor profile, instal it on your mac then open then ope
Launch Applications >> Utilities >> ColorSync Utility choose Adobe 1998 the hold and compare it with the Eizo Coloredge CG223W
profile. This is not the top of the range Eizo monitors that we use but you will see that this monitor will show most of the missing colour you monitor does not. This is actually a good tip if you are buying a monitor. Download the monitors profile and see how good it really is.
The weak link still is printing. The colors you see in RGB on a back lit RGB screen are very hard to reproduce by CYMK inks on paper. Here you really should have a profile made for your printer and chosen paper. If you don't want the expense of buying a calibrator and doing it yourself, there are on line services that will do this for you.
One final point you must remember. If you are using soft proofing in Photoshop ( "View >> Proof Setup >> Custom" as explained above), when you print you MUST choose in "Colour Handling" "Photoshop Manages Colour" and in the next step when the printing box appears
you will see a drop down box with "Layout" in it. Click on this and choose "Colour Management and choose "Off No Colour Management". If you do not do this Photoshop will manage the colour then the printer will do it again and the print will be a disaster.
This is a starting point really. Colour management is difficult but just try to remember that you need a translator between each step in the process to make it work so you have to make sure the correct profiles are being used by you camera, the program you use for opening the Raw photo files (Please don't use jpegs straight from the camera, but thats another subject), the correct monitor profile and output profile. If you don't check these it is like chinese whispers and your picture will be printed in Double Dutch!!.
Hope that helps. I am on location In Italy for a couple of months so will be unlikely to be able to reply to any questions for a while. Will try to check back and see how you are getting on. Drop me a line at [email protected] if you have any questions. Good luck.
Paul Williams

Color management detective needed!

I need help with some color management issues I'm having.
I've noticed that RAW images imported into Aperture (both 1.0.1 and 1.1) look very different than those imported into PS2 via ACR. I've been told that this is simply a result of the different conversion algorithims each program uses.
However, since I don't see a lot of discussion about that here I began to wonder if the differences I see between PS2 and Aperture are unusual. Also, I've noticed that when I export a RAW file from Aperture or PS2 as a JPEG, the colors of the resulting files look slightly different than they did before export (no adjustments were made in either program). Finally, when I upload the exported JPEGs to a website, the colors change once again!
This is very frustrating, because I spend a lot of time adjusting the image and finessing the colors... only to see it significantly altered when I put it on the web. I'd like to better understand what's happening here and have more control over the process.
So I've created a website with various examples of what I'm talking about. I imported the same RAW file into Aperture and PS2 without adjustments. Then I used OS X's Grab application to take a screen shot of how the image appears in each program. Then I exported the image as a JPEG from both PS2 and Aperture, using Adobe RGB as the embedded profile in both cases. (Note: my monitor profile is a custom profile created by EyeOne) Then I uploaded the JPEGs to a website I often display photos on, and then took a screen shot of how both the Aperture-exported and PS2-exported images appear on the web.
Please look at http://web.mac.com/chriskresser/iWeb/Site/Last%20Roll.html
So, my questions are:
1. Why does the color vary so dramatically between Aperture and PS2? Is this normal, i.e. do you experience the same thing? Is there something I can do about it?
2. Why do the exported JPEGs look different than their RAW master's? Again, is this normal and is there anything I can do about it?
3. Why do the JPEGs uploaded to the web look different than the JPEGs opened in Preview or PS2?
I've tried to standardize my color workspaces as much as possible, but I'm not sure I've done it correctly. In Aperture, onscreen proofing is off and I'm just using the default colorspace (which I understand is a wide-gamut RGB?). In PS2 I am using Adobe RGB as the working colorspace. My monitor profile is the custom calibrated Eye-One profile.
I really appreciate any help you can offer. I'm pulling my hair out trying to get this straight.
Thanks,
Chris

Thanks to everyone for helping me figure this out.
Let me make sure I understand. In Aperture, when I go to export a JPEG for web use or printing from another application with my home inkjet I select sRGB as the color space.
In PS2, I use Adobe RGB as my working color space, but when I save a JPEG for the web, I change the profile to sRGB before exporting. Do I use the "Edit>Convert to profile..." command for this? Or should I be using sRGB as my working color space in PS2 since most of my output is for the web and home inkjet? (There are occasionally times I send files to a printer for output, though).
The Aperture RAW and PS2 RAW look significantly different on my monitor too, not just on the web. I'm using the default ACR settings - do you think they need to be customized for my camera? I see what you are saying... the ACR RAW does look much brighter than the Aperture version and kind of washed out. Not sure how to fix that though...

Color management workflow for beginners..

I am making a movie. I have several hundred clips, shot over a period of almost 5 months. Indoors, outdoors, morning, afternoon, mid day etc. I have gained experience with my Panasonic HMC 151 over the months, and during this time used a variety of settings. I will also use still photos, and use some computer generated graphics made in Daz3D Carrara. All in all - I have a lot of material which look very different.
When layering my clips in After Effects, I want to do it right, and not paint myself into a corner.
When compiling my scenes (compositions) I also want to do it "right".
Most important to me is to get a coherent look and feel. This is the main priority. Later I might wish to change the overall color if I find out I want my movie to look more like a movie than a "video show". For example, I have shot some scenes late in May at noon, ans some scenes in the afternoon in September, and they belong to the same dialog where people talk to each others.
The target media is DVD for home TVs.
Any links to workflows and step-by-step guides (video tutors) on basic approaches on how to avoid the big mistakes is very much appreciated!
ingvarai

ingvarai:
Color Management in indeed an important aspect, but from your description, it seems that you should be concerned with "color correction" first.
Color Management is about getting reliable and predictable color rendition. It's not really about defining the "look" of your project. If your shots are not properly exposed, for example, Color Management will only make it more reliable to assure they're not properly exposed. Color correction is all about fixing those problems, or stylizing the overall look. If two takes don't intercut well, for example, then you have to correct color balance, exposure, so one matches the other.
After Effects includes a ton of effects which can be used for color correction, including Levels, Curves, Hue/Satuarion, etc. And it also includes a streamlined color correction plug-in called Color Finesse. I think the Color Finesse documentation is a good starting point, regardless of what you end up using. If you go to the folder in which After Effects is installed, and look into the "Effects" folder, you should see a folder called Synthetic Aperture. The Color Finesse manual should be inside that folder.
Also, After Effects Help has a section on Color correction and adjustments. It includes a number of links to other resources.
Mark Christiansen's book After Effects CS4 Visual Effects and Compositing Studio Techniques is very recommended.
As for the Color Management workflow, there's a specific white paper on the Adobe web site on this very subject, but I am not sure that's a good starting point. Instead, I think the AE help page on Color Management is better to get your feet wet, and then go through the white paper. Again, there are several links to other resources in the AE Help page about Color Management.

Color management needed

hi LR team, thanks for your great contribution!
I found there is no color management in LR. It's not easy to adjust photos between LR and PS if using a color scheme other than default sRGB. One pic has different looks...
So, I think it's helpful to add color management in LR, just like in PS.
Thanks!
uriel
uriel_li[at]yahoo.com.cn

Or, if you're editing some color values in Lightroom, perhaps you need to allow Lightroom to Render Standard-Sized Previews (which then are color managed), while the camera previews Lightroom otherwise uses (with a basic import) are not color managed.
Isn't this true?
Lightroom allows these Standard-Sized Previews to be rendered during Import (which extends the Import time dramatically) or afterwards, from the Library:Previews menu.
I just watched an online tutorial on this, and believe this info is accurate. could someone please elaborate. As a new user, I'd also like to be sure about this...

Help - color management issue, sunburns! (with a calibrated monitor)!

I love Lightroom and its workflow, its unlike anything of its kind. However, lately (since I first started using it) I've seen a problem related to color management on my computer (I believe) and hope someone out there can shed some light.
After importing JPG pictures into Lightroom and making modifications to them, I am getting *completely* different results once I export them (as sRGB, as I'll be sharing them via web). All of the pictures are coming much more saturated (for a lack of a better description).
Here is what I am getting (see brief descriptions below each pic): http://www.bachmannphoto.com/test/couple.html
I'd be very curious as to how they are showing up on your (calibrated/uncalibrated) screen(s), but the 1st and 3rd pics are showing up as 'realistic' on my PC, while the middle (exported from Lightroom) is showing up as too much saturation and even reddish push, as though the couple got hit with sunburns.
Another example of this result here: http://www.bachmannphoto.com/test/dog_chair.html. Though in this case, the picture in the middle actually looks better, it doesn't change the fact that I am getting very different output than what I see in Lightroom (or in photoshop without the embedded profile).
I am thinking this is a problem with color management settings on my PC. First guess would have been "monitor calibration"... but as mentioned in the title, I calibrated my monitors (I have two Dell 1905FPs... not great for accurate color representation, but they do the job) repeatedly, using Spyder2 Pro.
What pushes me to think this is the following (represented here http://www.bachmannphoto.com/test/couple_original.html ):
Before making any modifications to the imported sRGB picture - in other words, importing the picture straight from the camera memory card into Lightroom and then exporting it back (again, without making any modifications to it) - the pictures, both the original and the exported which still look the same and are kept sRGB, look completely different in Lightroom then if I was viewing them in a non-color managed software on my PC, such as the default windows picture viewer.
If my LCD panels are properly calibrated, should I not be more or less seeing the same image colors, whether I'm viewing them through windows, or through Lightroom (or Photoshop along with the embedded sRGB profile)? What gives??
Jesse
PS. I *more* than appreciate anyone taking time to respond to this post. I've been up for nights now trying to understand/fix this.
If it's any help, I have the different version (but original and exported) files here:
original file:
http://www.bachmannphoto.com/test/couple_original.JPG
Original file, imported into Lightroom and then exported back out w/o any modifications (sRGB): http://www.bachmannphoto.com/test/couple_lightroom-nomidification_exported_srgb.jpg
Original file, imported into Lightroom, MODIFIED and then exported back out (sRGB):
http://www.bachmannphoto.com/test/couple_lightroom-modified_exported_srgb.jpg

Exiftool reports the original contains the following EXIF tags:
Interoperability Index : R98 - DCF basic file (sRGB)
Interoperability Version : 0100
The nomidification_exported version does not have those lines, but contains the actual sRGB profile:
Profile CMM Type : Lino
Profile Version : 2.1.0
Profile Class : Display Device Profile
Color Space Data : RGB
Profile Connection Space : XYZ
Profile Date Time : 1998:02:09 06:49:00
Profile File Signature : acsp
Primary Platform : Microsoft Corporation
CMM Flags : Not Embedded, Independent
Device Manufacturer : IEC
Device Model : sRGB
Device Attributes : Reflective, Glossy, Positive, Color
Rendering Intent : Perceptual
Connection Space Illuminant : 0.9642 1 0.82491
Profile Creator : HP
Profile ID : 0
Profile Copyright : Copyright (c) 1998 Hewlett-Packard Company
Profile Description : sRGB IEC61966-2.1
Media White Point : 0.95045 1 1.08905
Media Black Point : 0 0 0
Red Matrix Column : 0.43607 0.22249 0.01392
Green Matrix Column : 0.38515 0.71687 0.09708
Blue Matrix Column : 0.14307 0.06061 0.7141
Device Mfg Desc : IEC http://www.iec.ch
Device Model Desc : IEC 61966-2.1 Default RGB colour space - sRGB
Viewing Cond Desc : Reference Viewing Condition in IEC61966-2.1
Viewing Cond Illuminant : 19.6445 20.3718 16.8089
Viewing Cond Surround : 3.92889 4.07439 3.36179
Viewing Cond Illuminant Type : D50
Luminance : 76.03647 80 87.12462
Measurement Observer : CIE 1931
Measurement Backing : 0 0 0
Measurement Geometry : Unknown (0)
Measurement Flare : 0.999 %
Measurement Illuminant : D65
Technology : Cathode Ray Tube Display
Red Tone Reproduction Curve : (Binary data 2060 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Green Tone Reproduction Curve : (Binary data 2060 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Blue Tone Reproduction Curve : (Binary data 2060 bytes, use -b option to extract)
The modified_exported version likewise does not have the interoperability index tag but contains the actual sRGB profile:
Profile CMM Type : Lino
Profile Version : 2.1.0
Profile Class : Display Device Profile
Color Space Data : RGB
Profile Connection Space : XYZ
Profile Date Time : 1998:02:09 06:49:00
Profile File Signature : acsp
Primary Platform : Microsoft Corporation
CMM Flags : Not Embedded, Independent
Device Manufacturer : IEC
Device Model : sRGB
Device Attributes : Reflective, Glossy, Positive, Color
Rendering Intent : Perceptual
Connection Space Illuminant : 0.9642 1 0.82491
Profile Creator : HP
Profile ID : 0
Profile Copyright : Copyright (c) 1998 Hewlett-Packard Company
Profile Description : sRGB IEC61966-2.1
Media White Point : 0.95045 1 1.08905
Media Black Point : 0 0 0
Red Matrix Column : 0.43607 0.22249 0.01392
Green Matrix Column : 0.38515 0.71687 0.09708
Blue Matrix Column : 0.14307 0.06061 0.7141
Device Mfg Desc : IEC http://www.iec.ch
Device Model Desc : IEC 61966-2.1 Default RGB colour space - sRGB
Viewing Cond Desc : Reference Viewing Condition in IEC61966-2.1
Viewing Cond Illuminant : 19.6445 20.3718 16.8089
Viewing Cond Surround : 3.92889 4.07439 3.36179
Viewing Cond Illuminant Type : D50
Luminance : 76.03647 80 87.12462
Measurement Observer : CIE 1931
Measurement Backing : 0 0 0
Measurement Geometry : Unknown (0)
Measurement Flare : 0.999 %
Measurement Illuminant : D65
Technology : Cathode Ray Tube Display
Red Tone Reproduction Curve : (Binary data 2060 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Green Tone Reproduction Curve : (Binary data 2060 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Blue Tone Reproduction Curve : (Binary data 2060 bytes, use -b option to extract)

Fully Color Managed Application (using calibrated monitor profiles)

Hi,
I'm new to JAVA 2D so I may be missing something obvious - apologies if I am, but I've been trawling the API and web to try and solve this for many hours - so any help would be much appreciated!
I'm trying to write an application to open a JPEG with an embedded colour profile (in this case AdobeRGB) and display it with correct colour on my monitor, for which I have an accurate custom hardware calibrated profile. In my efforts to do this several problems / queries have arisen.
So, JAVA aside, the concept is simple:
a) Open the image
b) Transform the pixels from AdobeRGB->Monitor Profile (via a PCS such as CIEXYZ).
c) Blit it out to the window.
(a) is fine. I've used the following code snip, and can query the resulting BufferedImage and see it has correctly extracted the AdobeRGB profile. I can even display it (non-color corrected) using the Graphics2D.drawImage() function in my components paint() method.
BufferedImage img = ImageIO.read(new File("my-adobe-rgb.jpg"));(b) Also seems OK (well at least no exceptions)...
ICC_Profile monitorProfile = ICC_Profile.getInstance("Monitor_Calibrated.icm");
    ColorConvertOp convert = new ColorConvertOp(new ICC_ColorSpace(monitorProfile ),null);
    BufferedImage imgColorAdjusted = convert.filter(img,null);[I was feeling hopeful at this point!]
QUESTION 1: Does this conversion go through the CIEXYZ (I hope) rather than sRGB, there seems to be no way to specify and the docs are not clear on this?
(c) Here is the major problem...
When I pass imgColorAdjusted to the Graphic2D.drawImage() in my components paint() method the JVM just hangs and consumes 100% CPU.
QUESTION 2: Any ideas why it hangs?
Pausing in the debugger I found the API was busy transforming by image to sRGB this leads to my third question...
QUESTION 3: If I pass an image with a color model to drawImage() does drawImage do any color conversion, e.g will it transform my adobe image to sRGB (not what I want in this case!)?
And if answer to Q3 is yes, which I suspect it is, then the next question is how to make the J2D understand that I have a calibrated monitor, and to tell it the profile, so that the Graphics2D it provides in paint() has the correct color model. Looking in the API I thought this was provided to J2D through the GraphicsEnviroment->GraphicsDevice->GraphicsConfiguration.getColorModel(). I tried looking at what these configurations were (code below). Result - 10 configurations, all with the JAVA 2D sRGB default, despite my monitor colour management (through the windows display properties dialog) being set to the calibrated profile.
QUESTION 4: Am I just off track here - does Java 2D support monitor profiles other than sRGB? Is what I am trying possible?
GraphicsConfiguration[] cfg = GraphicsEnvironment.getLocalGraphicsEnvironment().getDefaultScreenDevice().getConfigurations();
    System.out.println(cfg.length);
    byte[] d;
    for (int j=0; j<cfg.length; j++) {
      System.out.println("CFG:"+j+cfg[j]);
      d = ((ICC_ColorSpace)cfg[j].getColorModel().getColorSpace()).getProfile().getData();
      for (int i=0; i<d.length && i<256; i++){
        if (d[i] != 10 && d[i] != 13){
          System.out.print((char)d);
System.out.println();
Any help much appreciated.
Thanks.

I have had some sucess with this, but it wasn't easy or obvious. The trick is converting the color to the monitor profile and then changing the color model to be sRGB without changing the pixel data. JAI's Format operation does this easily although I'm sure there are other ways to do it. The RGB data is then displayed without being converted to sRGB so that the monitor calibration is maintained. I will answer your questions since I had similar ones.
Q1. Yes the conversion is done using XYZ as it should be.
Q2. I believe paint is just very slow, not hanging. Any color model other than XYZ or sRGB requires conversion before it can be displayed (as sRGB). This is both slow and incorrect for a calibrated monitor.
Q3. Yes that is what I have found, a conversion to sRGB will always happen, unless it appears to be already done as when the color model is sRGB (even though the pixel data is not!).
Q4. It is possible but apparently only with this somewhat strange work around. If there is a way to change the Java display profile to be other than sRGB, I could not find it either. However, calibrated RGB display can be achieved.
Since I have seen many other posts asking for an example of color management, here is some code. This JAI conversion works for many pairs of source and destination profiles including CMYK to RGB. It does require using ICC profiles in external files rather than embedded in the image.
package calibratedrgb;
import com.sun.media.jai.widget.DisplayJAI;
import java.awt.*;
import java.awt.color.*;
import java.awt.image.*;
import java.io.IOException;
import javax.media.jai.*;
import javax.swing.*;
* @author keitht
public class Main {
    public static void main(String[] args) throws IOException {
        String filename = args[0];
        PlanarImage pi = JAI.create("fileload", filename);
        // create a source color model from the image ICC profile
        ICC_Profile sourceProfile = ICC_Profile.getInstance("AdobeRGB1998.icc");
        ICC_ColorSpace sourceCS = new ICC_ColorSpace(sourceProfile);
        ColorModel sourceCM = RasterFactory.createComponentColorModel(
                pi.getSampleModel().getDataType(), sourceCS, false, false,Transparency.OPAQUE);
        ImageLayout sourceIL = new ImageLayout();
        sourceIL.setColorModel(sourceCM);
        // tag the image with the source profile using format
        RenderingHints sourceHints = new RenderingHints(JAI.KEY_IMAGE_LAYOUT, sourceIL);
        ParameterBlockJAI ipb = new ParameterBlockJAI("format");
        ipb.addSource(pi);
        ipb.setParameter("datatype", pi.getSampleModel().getDataType());
        pi = JAI.create("format", ipb, sourceHints);
        // create a destination color model from the monitor ICC profile
        ICC_Profile destinationProfile = ICC_Profile.getInstance("Monitor Profile.icm");
        ICC_ColorSpace destinationCS = new ICC_ColorSpace(destinationProfile);
        ColorModel destinationCM = RasterFactory.createComponentColorModel(
                pi.getSampleModel().getDataType(), destinationCS, false, false, Transparency.OPAQUE);
        ImageLayout destinationIL = new ImageLayout();
        destinationIL.setColorModel(destinationCM);
        // convert from source to destination profile
        RenderingHints destinationHints = new RenderingHints(JAI.KEY_IMAGE_LAYOUT, destinationIL);
        ParameterBlockJAI cpb = new ParameterBlockJAI("colorconvert");
        cpb.addSource(pi);
        cpb.setParameter("colormodel", destinationCM);
        pi = JAI.create("colorconvert", cpb, destinationHints);
        // image is now the calibrated monitor RGB data ready to display, but
        // an unwanted conversion to sRGB will occur without the following...
        // first, create an sRGB color model
        ColorSpace sRGB = ColorSpace.getInstance(ColorSpace.CS_sRGB);
        ColorModel sRGBcm = RasterFactory.createComponentColorModel(
                pi.getSampleModel().getDataType(), sRGB, false, false, Transparency.OPAQUE);
        ImageLayout sRGBil = new ImageLayout();
        sRGBil.setColorModel(sRGBcm);
        // then avoid the incorrect conversion to sRGB on the way to the display
        // by using format to tag the image as sRGB without changing the data
        RenderingHints sRGBhints = new RenderingHints(JAI.KEY_IMAGE_LAYOUT, sRGBil);
        ParameterBlockJAI sRGBpb = new ParameterBlockJAI("format");
        sRGBpb.addSource(pi);
        sRGBpb.setParameter("datatype", pi.getSampleModel().getDataType());
        pi = JAI.create("format", sRGBpb, sRGBhints); // replace color model with sRGB
        // RGB numbers are unaffected and can now be sent without conversion to the display
        // disguised as sRGB data. The platform monitor calibration profile is bypassed
        // by the JRE because sRGB is the default graphics configuration color model profile
        JFrame frame = new JFrame();
        Container contentPane = frame.getContentPane();
        contentPane.setLayout(new BorderLayout());
        DisplayJAI d = new DisplayJAI(pi); // Graphics2D could be used here
        contentPane.add(new JScrollPane(d),BorderLayout.CENTER);
        frame.setDefaultCloseOperation(JFrame.EXIT_ON_CLOSE);
        frame.setSize(600,600);
        frame.setVisible(true);
}

Please help. Photoshop isn't displaying colors correctly after new monitor/calibration

When I open JPEGS or RAW images in photoshop they have a dull, flat color to them. This is happening after recently buying a NEW PA271W wide-gamut display and calibrating it using Spectraview 2. It doesn't matter whether I have the Working Space in PS set to Adobe RGB or sRGB under color settings... The only way I can make my image look normal is to go under settings and ASSIGN PROFILE to Adobe RGB. It looks fine then. I could live with that, except the bigger problem is that I begin my editing process in RAW, where the colors are also looking flat. The best I can tell, there is no way to assign a profile at this stage... and I don't even know if that would help.
I've been working in photoshop many years and I do know that RAW images have a 'flatter' appearance to being with, but this is something completely different. For example, when I slide photoshop onto my other monitor next to it (I have multiple monitors) - the color reverts to the normal color I want . And if I then slide photoshop back onto my new NEC monitor, the normal color actually stays intact for about two seconds, then reverts back to the dull color. So I am unable to begin my work process in RAW since the colors are wrong. Also, I know that my new monitor is capbable of displaying my images in their proper colors because when I use any of several different image viewers I have - irfanview, etc. - everything is fine. It's only in photoshop. Any help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Chance. Oh, and I have CS5 and I'm using Windows 7.

What you're describing sounds like your display profile is incorrect.
Don't mess with the working space, don't assign profiles -- just fix the display profile.

VISTA color management and monitor calibration

Elements 7.0
VISTA Home Premium SP1
Nvidia 8600
Samsung SyncMaster 213T
Canon XSi
Multiple printers
Since getting new system with Vista, I haven't been able to get a print that looks like my screen. I tried Costco today and everything was much darker than I expected, but the reds were much richer. I read a lot about calibrating my monitor, but it is possible that there is more do it than that? Learning to adjust skin tone etc. in Photoshop, only to have the prints look bad is pretty frustrating.
Is the other option to invest in a quality printer, or go to a real lab instead of Costco?
Please use small words, since I'm not a professional.
Regards,
Michael

Michael, color management is certainly a difficult issue to perfect. My monitor is color calibrated but it doesn't guarantee that the prints will match. With the same image, I get different results from different printers and labs. I get the best results from labs in the local camera/photo shops, and the pricing for enlargements is still on par with like Snapfish or Kodak.
Check this setting in PSE: Edit>Color Settings...>Always Optimize for Printing. I would suggest color calibrating your monitor, then try different labs until you find the best results.

Severe color issues in CS5, EizoCG245W monitor, calibrated...help!

Hi!
I'm working with an entirely new system here from the ground up. New computer with Windows 7, Eizo ColorEdge CG245W monitor and Photoshop CS5 (I had previously been using CS3 on my old system/monitor). Everything was hooked up within the last couple of days and PS installed as well.
The problem I am having is that when I open an image in PS, it is severely dull and desaturated looking (esp in the reds, yellows and oranges).
The "color settings" I am using are correct for the lab I print at. I am using sRGB.
Thing is, when I view the image in My Pictures or on the Web (IE or Firefox) or in Microsoft Office Picture Manager....the image looks correct and the same as my lab test prints.
But if I view the image in either CS5 or Windows Photo Viewer, I get that horrible dull/desaturated look.
I should mention as well that my monitor is calibrated...I did that yesterday upon getting everything hooked up. When I am in CS5 and choose "Assign Profile"...if I choose the monitor profile generated by the calibrator (mine is CG245W (22547100) Photography, Graphic Design) then the image looks correct and all of the colors are saturated nicely. But, obviously, I cannot choose this as my working space or color profile!!!
What is going on? It's almost as if there is a problem with Windows not recognizing the calibrated profile or something...but I am unable to fix this and I NEED it fixed asap!!!
Thank you!

Is it possible that what you perceive as "correct" is actually oversaturated?
I'm not familiar with that monitor... Is it a wide gamut monitor? If so, you'd expect sRGB to look less saturated than the same images displayed in non-color-managed applications.
You do realize that images displayed in IE 8 and earlier, and many other photo viewing applications, are not displayed through a color-management system, right? These are not color-managed applications. Photoshop is. Also, assigning the monitor profile to your image essentially shuts color management off.
What you're saying is essentially that you like what you see when color is not managed.
Assuming no unexpected glitch, such as a bad profile, all seems to hinge on what color space the monitor is delivering, and whether it was delivering that same color when calibrated.
How did you calibrate/profile it, specifically?
-Noel

Help - monitor calibration-color management disaster!

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