Compression Data Rate.

Forum,
I am editing some footage and receive the warning,among others,
to lower the" Compression Data Rate".
Well, I have spent two hours going through "Help" and can not find how to do this.
Would some one direct me to the area where this option is available?
Thanks,
Michael.

Kevan,
Thank you for your reply.
I have a MAc Pro 8 core.
The Mac HD and drive with video files are both 1.5 TB and have a speed of 7200rpm. with plenty of spare space and recently defragged.
The footage is from a book titled FCP 7 "advanced editing"
I presume it is NTSC but there is indication that is so.
Your reply prompted me to search further and at last found "data rate" in" help"
Every thing I need is there.
I will mark solved.
Michael.

Similar Messages

Lowering Compression Data Rate

I hope someone can help. I'm am getting a message that reads Warning-Dropped frames then suggests I turn off RT Unlimited (which I've done) then "Lowering Compression Data Rate". I haven't a clue what that means or how to do it. I'd appreciate any insight.
TAB

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Disk Description : IBM-IC35L060AVVA07-0 Total Capacity : 57.3 GB (61,492,838,400 Bytes)
Connection Bus : ATA Write Status : Read/Write
Connection Type : Internal S.M.A.R.T. status : Verified
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Connection Bus : ATA Write Status : Read/Write
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Standard Video Compression Settings: Data Rate

I have imported a VHS tape using a DV converter, but the file is huge, and I want it to be able to fit onto a DVD. The file size is around 25 GB, way to big of a file, especially for the video's quality. I am trying to compress it so I went to File: Export: QuickTime Conversion. From there I selected QuickTime Movie and clicked on options. A window came up called "Movie Settings" and under "video" I clicked on "settings". Under Compression Type I clicked H.264. Under "data rate" I clicked on "restrict to" and then there was a blank space to put in the kbits/sec. Under "Optimized for" I clicked on CD/DCD-ROM. I do not know how many kbits/sec I should have. I want to maintain the best possible quality while having it fit onto a DVD.

Don't worry about file size at this point; the determining factor is program length. A single layer 4.7GB DVD will hold about two hours of video. The compression is handled in the DVD authoring application.
From FCE, just export to QuickTime Movie (do not use QT Conversion). If you'll burn the DVD on the same computer, make sure the "self-contained" box is unchecked for a much quicker export.

I have a question about Data Rates.

Hello All.
This is a bit of a noob question I'm sure. I don't think I really understand Data Rates and how it applies to Motion... therefore I'm not even sure what kind of questions to ask. I've been reading up online and thought I would ask some questions here. Thanks to all in advance.
I've never really worried about Data Rates until now. I am creating an Apple Motion piece with about 15 different video clips in it. And 1/2 of them have alpha channels.
What exactly is Data Rate? Is it the rate in which video clip data is read (in bits/second) from the Disc and placed into my screen? In Motion- is the Data Rate for video only? What if the clip has audio? If a HDD is simply a plastic disc with a dye read by "1" laser... how come my computer can pull "2" files off the disc at the same time? Is that what data transfer is all about? Is that were RAM comes into play?
I have crunched my clips as much as I can. They are short clips (10-15seconds each). I've compressed them with the Animation codec to preserve the Alpha channel and sized them proportionally smaller (320x240). This dropped their data rate significantly. I've also taken out any audio that was associated with them.
Is data rate what is slowing my system down?
The data rates are all under 2MBs. Some are as low as 230Kbs. They were MUCH higher. However, my animation still plays VERY slowly.
I'm running a 3GigRam Powerbook Pro 2.33GHz.
I store all my media on a 1TB GRaid Firewire 800 drive. However for portability I'm using a USB 2 smartdisk external drive. I think the speed is 5200rpm.
I'm guessing this all plays into the speed at which motion can function.
If I total my data rate transfer I get somewhere in the vicinity of 11MBs/second. Is that what motion needs for it to play smoothly a 11MBs/second data connection? USB 2.0 is like what 480Mbs/second. So there is no way it's going to play quickly. What if I played it from my hard drive? What is the data rate of my internal HDD?
I guess my overall question is.
#1. Is my thinking correct on all of these topics? Do my bits, bytes and megs make sense. Is my thought process correct?
#2. Barring getting a new machine or buying new hardware. What can I do to speed up this workflow? Working with 15 different video clips is bogging Motion down and becoming frustrating to work with. Even if only 3-4 of the clips are up at a time it bogs things down. Especially if I throw on a glow effect or something.
Any help is greatly appreciated.
-Fraky

Data rate DOES make a difference, but I'd say your real problem has more to do with the fact that you're working on a Powerbook. Motion's real time capabilities derive from the capability of the video card. Not the processor. Some cards do better than others, but laptops are not even recommended for running Motion.
To improve your workflow on a laptop will be limited, but there are a few things that you can try.
Make sure that thumbnails and previews are turned off.
Make sure that you are operating in Draft Mode.
Lower the display resolution to half, or quarter.
Don't expect to be getting real time playback. Treat it more like After Effects.
Compressing your clips into smaller Animations does help because it lowers the data rate, but you're still dealing with the animation codec which is a high data rate codec. Unfortunately, it sounds necessary in your case because you're dealing with alpha channels.
The data rate comes into play with your setup trying to play through your USB drive. USB drives are never recommended for editing or Motion work. Their throughput is not consistent enough for video work. a small FW drive would be better, though your real problem as I said is the Powerbook.
If you must work on the powerbook, then don't expect real-time playback. Instead, build your animation, step through it, and do RAM previews to view sections in real time.
I hope this helps.
Andy

H.264 All-Intra Data Rates Significantly Higher

Does the built-in H.264 codec encode I-frame only files differently? I am trying to determine the optimal GOP length for high bitrate exports. Image quality seems to degrade, even in the I-frames, when using key frame distances greater than one.
After performing a series of tests to characterize the Adobe H.264 encoder, I discovered that exported files are significantly larger when key frame distance equals one frame (N=1). The average video data rate for a test file rendered with the Adobe H.264 encoder is as follows:
N=1 : 2.17 bpp : 24I
N=2 : 0.66 bpp : 12I + 12P
N=3 : 0.59 bpp : 8I + 8B + 8P
Note how the data rate drops 70% (from 2.17 to 0.66 bpp) even though 50% of the I-frames still exist when N=2. By comparison, here is the video data rate when exporting with QuickTime H.264:
N=1 : 0.89 bpp : 24I
N=2 : 0.70 bpp : 12I + 12P
N=3 : 0.64 bpp : 8I + 16P
The following chart shows data rates at key frame distances from 1-48 frames for Adobe H.264, QuickTime H.264 (via Adobe), QuickTime Pro, and Expression Encoder 4 Pro. Data rates are consistent among all encoders at GOP lengths greater than one. There is an anomoly with the Adobe H.264 codec compressing all-intra files.
The observed behavior occurs in all profiles, which were tested at Levels 4.1, 4.2, 5.0, and 5.1:
Image quality is better in the Adobe H.264 all-intraframe file, especially with respect to detail retention. The pictures below show sections of two consecutive frames magnified 400%. The file with N=2 is less accurate and contains noticeable blocking. Even the I-frames don't look as good in the files where N>1.
The test file was a seventeen second Premiere Pro sequence consisting of H.264, MPEG-2, and AE files with effects applied. Exports were rendered from the Premiere Pro timeline and from a V210 uncompressed 4:2:2 intermediate file of the sequence. The following settings were used:
Format: H.264
Width: 1280
Height: 720
Frame Rate: 24 fps
Field Order: Progressive
Aspect: Square Pixels (1.0)
TV Standard: NTSC
Profile: Baseline, Main, and High
Levels: 4.1, 4.2, 5.0, 5.1
Render at Maximum Bit Depth: Enabled
Bitrate Encoding: VBR, 2-Pass
Target Bitrate: Maximized for each Profile/Level
Maximum Bitrate: Maximized for each Profile/Level
Key Frame Distance: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 12, 24, 48
Use Maximum Render Quality: Enabled
Multiplexer: MP4
Stream Capability: Standard
Software:
Adobe Media Encoder CS6 Creative Cloud v6.0.3.1 (64-bit)
Premiere Pro CS6 Creative Cloud v6.0.3
Windows 7 SP1
QuickTime Pro for Windows v7.6.9 (1680.9)
MediaInfo 0.7.62 (for GOP and data rate information)

I think the short answer is yes,
a h.264 encoder does I-frame only differently. I frames are complete expressions of a picture with no temporal compression information.
P frames use _P_redictive information. IE information from prior frames.
B frames use _B_i-directional predictive frame information.
h.264 gets the majority of it's bit saving from use of B and P frames. When you do I-frame only you only get the block compression and none of the advantages of P and B frames. Thus the GOP N=1 doesn't get very good bit's per pixel.
Having said all that I do find your comment...
Profitic wrote:
Note how the data rate drops 70% (from 2.17 to 0.66 bpp) even though 50% of the I-frames still exist when N=2. By comparison, here is the video data rate when exporting with QuickTime H.264:
... very interesting. Indeed, why is the datarate 70% less when it should at best be 50% for GOP N=2. 50% less should be the same I-frame information plus 0 bytes for the B frame between them. (GOP = I,B,I). Any more than that and it is throwing away bits from the I-frame. So, this seems to be to be a ratecontrol bug.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Group_of_pictures
"The GOP structure is often referred by two numbers, for example, M=3, N=12. The first number tells the distance between two anchor frames (I or P): it is the GOP size. The second one tells the distance between two full images (I-frames): it is the GOP length. For the example M=3, N=12, the GOP structure is IBBPBBPBBPBBI. Instead of the M parameter the maximal count of B-frames between two consecutive anchor frames can be used."

In Aperture 3.4 Export Slideshow to a video, what are the actual Data Rates used for "Best", "High", ... "Least" quality for a given resolution?

My Photo website host (SmugMug) converts uploaded video files at a specific Data Rate in Mbps before installing them. I would like to compress my slideshow video file to the same rate before I upload it to reduce file size and upload time. When I choose the "Custom" setting for an Export, I can choose 1 of the 5 Quality choices and see the estimated file size. But, I cannot know what the actual Data Rate is until after I wait a long time to export the slideshow (hours for a long slideshow) and then examine the resulting file in QuickTime Player's Inspector.

I ran a few tests using a short slideshow (16 images, 1:23 mins/secs) at 1,728 x 1,080 resolution to find out the bit rates for various quality level choices.
Export setting              Quality          Resulting bit rate          File Size
HD 1080p                    default                20.68 Mbps              214.8 MBytes
Custom                       Best                   20.49                       212.8
Custom                       High                     6.25                         65.0
Custom                       Medium                3.97                         41.3
However, I don't know if those bit rates will be the same for different length slideshows or for different output resolutions. My SmugMug host site uses an 8.0 Mbps rate for a 1728 x 1080 video file. If I choose Custom/Best, my file will be almost 3 times bigger and much higher quality than necessary, but if I choose Custom/High, my file will be smaller and lower quality than SmugMug's converted version.
I have installed MPEG StreamClip that will let me convert an exported Aperture slideshow video file, and StreamClip allows me to choose a specific bit rate in Mbps. But, I would prefer not having to do a 2 step process (Export from Aperture, then convert in StreamClip).

What chokes H.264 footage: data rate or video dimensions?

I apologize for posting in here but this board is SO much better than the Quicktime or Compressor boards, and it's all the same workflow anyhow!
What I'm wondering is what chokes H.264 videos. Is it low bit rates? High bit rates? Big dimensions? I have an 854x480 video at 500kbps and it looks great, but even on my PowerMac there is slight stuttering, and some alpha tester feedback I've gotten tells me that a lot of slower computers are choking on the video badly.
The file size is ridiculously small, so if increasing the data rate makes it easier to decode, that would be nice.

It's neither - or either, if you will. H.264 achieves unprecedented levels of compression, which means that it's a lot more CPU-intensive to play back in real time. It simply doesn't play well on older hardware. Even slower G5s for example have problems playing back full HD H.264, particularly if it's progressive. It also depends on your GPU - certain GPUs support H.264 decoding, thus significantly offloading the CPU.
One general rule, though: the higher your data rate at any given frame size and frame rate, the less work the decoder needs to do. I'd try to go for approx. 800 kbps at your chosen frame size and see if that helps.
HTH,
Ron

Encoded video does not have expected data rate

Hi
I've been encoding with Flash Media Encoder (CS3) recently
and come across a contradiction which I can't seem to make sense
of. Can it be possible that the longer the video, the harder it is
for the encoder to maintain data rate?
This was revealed when I started using FMS2 (space on a
shared server as opposed to my own server). I encoded a video at
what I thought was a data rate which was within my data rate limit
for my stream and it stuttered on playback over the stream. The FMS
supplier informed me that the FLV I thought I'd encoded at 400kbps
video 96 kbps audio actually had a data rate of around 700kbps in
total. But if I open the video in a FLV player, and look at info,
it still shows the setting I originally intended. However, my
supplier suggested checking data rate using this equation:
(filesize in MB x 8)/videoduration in seconds = video
datarate in kbits/sec
If you apply this calculation to my video it does indeed show
what they said:
Using Flash Media Encoder:
Encoded at 400kbps video - 96 kbps audio
Compressed filesize = 26,517 kbytes
Duration = 240 seconds
CALCULATION GIVES DATE RATE OF 880k/b a second
(note file contains an alpha channel)
Furthermore, applied to a shorter video, we get the following
more logical results:
Encoded at 400kbps video - 96 kbps audio
Compressed filesize = 6,076 kbytes
Duration = 90 seconds
CALCULATION GIVES DATA RATE OF 527 kb/sec
(no alpha channel)
The only differences between the two vids is the alpha
channel and the duration. Somethings doesn't add up here.
Any clues?
Thanks
Simon

I've just partly answered my own question. Funny how writing
a post can help you think your problem through sometimes.
The issue is the alpha channel, which adds to the file size
thereby making the data rate "incorrect". In other words, the same
file encoded without the alpha channel provides the expected
results. I guess this changes my question to: How do I create
predicatable data rates when encoding using an alpha channel. I
could just estimate of course and see what comes out, but is there
a better way?
SImon.

Files failing to adhere to set data rate on export from Quicktime

I am hoping somebody can shed some light on this.
I open an uncompressed .mov file (output from FinalCut) with Quicktime with the intention of compressing it for the web. After File: export, in the options dialog box, in the field where you can restrict the data rate, I put a number, say 488 kbs/sec. But every time I do this, the finished compressed file has a data rate wildly higher, like 2000 kbs/sec, and so is too large for my purposes.
I feel like I used to do this all the time- I have plenty of .mov files with data rates around 500 kbs/sec that I posted on my website, so this had to have worked at some time in the past.
Anybody? Thanks

Just a bump-

Export data rates

Hi folks,
What is the purpose of automatic data rates as opposed to specified data rates when exporting H.264 etc in FCP?
Are there ideal data rates for different dimension/levels of compression?
If so what are they and where can I find more info on them?
All a little confusing!

No one responded.

Transfer data rate

OK, so I have resolved an older problem only to have dropped frames all the time during playback. How do I find out the maximum transfer data rate my processor can handle? ANy suggestions on how to get around an issue like that? If I want clean crisp graphics, how can I avoid the DV codec - which I understand is awful for graphics- yet still be able to play my sequence back without dropped frames?

Hi Kristin,
If I read correctly, you moved everything off your internal drive to an external. This external drive - is it a SATA drive, or FireWire? You mentioned SATA before, so I'm inclined to think that's what it is. If it IS an external Serial ATA drive, when you got it, did you zero all data on the drive before using it?
Also, when you started using this new external, did you change your capture/render drive settings in your prefs in FCP? If not, they may still be set to your system drive, the default, instead of your new external hard drive. If this is the case, change it in FCP, save, and quit. TRASH the render files and move all the capture files from the system disk. re-open FCP, reconnect the moved capture files (if any), and of course, you'll have to re-render most of your timeline. when you do this, it'll render everything to the new hard drive (SATA, yes?), and you SHOULD be good to go.
Now, as for interfacing with a monitor or an external device - are you going throgh firewire to a camera or deck and then to your video monitor? If so, no matter what, you won't be able to view anything but a single frame at a time with uncompressed. The only other thing that I can think of is that your camera/deck/external video device is powered on while you're trying to do this. In order to monitor Uncompressed externally, you need a pretty spiffy video capture card like the Kona. But internally, you should have no issues. So, make sure any external device except a hard drive is turned OFF, and disconnected.
If none of this works, what you may want to do is change your sequence settings back to NTSC/DV for compression, and when you're totally done editing your project, you change them BACK to uncompressed, render, and export an uncompressed file to an external hard drive, take that drive to a video production company, have them slap it on a DigitalBeta tape as a master, and you're good to go.
Hope this helps...
-Kris

H.264 data rate difference between local and distributed encode

Doing some testing today and noticed this curious behavior with compressor 3.5.1:
Set video encode for a 50 second 1080i uncompressed file to H.264 at 50000 kbps (50 mbps). Audio is 24 bit, 48khz stereo with no compression.
1. Sending the job to "This computer" for a local-only encode gives me a file size of 327 MB
2. Sending the same job to the same computer using distributed encoding gives me a file size of 211 MB
The data rate for the distributed encoded file is about 34 mbps, which isn't what was specified in the encode settings in Compressor. The data rate for the locally encoded file is about 52 mbps, which is what I would expect when the audio is taken into account.
Why the difference? Both encoded files are the same duration, so there aren't any missing frames. They both look good and play well but this is giving me cause for pause.
Also, another curious difference I noticed... The distributed file has the More Info fields populated with useful information in the Finder (dimensions, codecs, duration, channel count, total bit rate). The locally encoded file does not have this information.
-Matt

Hi,
Not sure if this can be corrected whit customizing. Please see SAP note 1065932 for background on currencies in asset accounting. Some explanations on differences in currencies can be found there.
Regards,
Andre

AVC INTRA 100 INGESTED CLIPS SHOWING MYSTERIOUSLY LOW DATA RATES

Just finished my first P2 chroma key shoot using AVC Intra 100. I have ingested and transcoded using log and transfer using Pro Res 422 HQ (we shot 1080 25p) Each clip is showing a data rate of around 20mbps, yet the white paper on Pro Res suggests 200mbps data rates. Even the AVC intra files are showing data rates of around 20mbps-despite the 100mbps AVC Intra- IHow come the files are showing such low data rates? How come they are not reading 200mbps??? What did I do wrong or what am I not understanding about data rates??? Thanks

Before all Hi Tom Hi Klaus and Hi String
i was looking at the forum for some one that has having the same problem than i and found it!
I'm using this new HPX-300 with the AVC-INTRA 100 codec. And when i import the content using log and transfer (final cut 7!!!) with avc-intra native plug-in, all that, to apple prores 422 hq compression the size of the video is like 14 mb/s is that right? and the quality doesn't look so good too, but this i fink is because of my computer.... AND THE INFORMATION OF THE VIDEO IN THE INFO WINDOW (more info part) IS SAYING:
DIMENDION 1920x1080
CODEC: AI16, LINEAR PMC, TIMECODE ---> why not apple Pro Res 422 (hq) ???
COLOR PROFILE:HD (1-1-1) ---> This should't be 4-2-2 ?!?!?!?!?!
If some one can explain to me who does this work i apreciate!
And all ways Tanks for sharing!
Message was edited by: Gustavo AVC-intra

DV BITRATE VS DATA RATE...

Hi -- I've a question about DV's bitrate (25Mbps) and data rate (3.6MBps).
(1) What is the relationship between one another?
(2) Does FCP decompress DV's 25Mbps bitrate and recompress when printing to tape?
(3) What of outputting to MPEG2 DVD? Say at 7Mbps bitrate -- does FCP recompress when outputting to this destination type?
(4) What is the BEST way to capture, edit and output (to DVD) for FCP5.1.2 where visual quality is concerned?
Thanks

1. they are the exact same ... DV has a fixed data rate of 25 megabits per second. 1 byte = 8 bits, so the 25Mbps may sometimes be approximated to 3.6MBps
2. yes and no. FCP's DV codec (compressor,decompressor) is used to display the footage to your canvas, however, unless you otherwise affect the footage then it is only the raw original data that is printed to tape.
3. yes ... if the ouptput is a different codec than that of the original then it must be transcoded, hence decompressed using the original codec and recompressed using the target codec
4. capture using the highest possible quality your system can handle (preferably uncompressed), edit natively in that same codec, output for dvd using the highest bitrate MPEG2 your compression/ dvd burning sofware can handle

Quick Notation Question - Data Rates/Frame Rates/Interlacing

Finally upgraded to a decent prosumer camera and I'm trying to decipher what the manual is telling me about the many different formats it shoots and and the associated options. I keep seeing things like "There are two basic shooting modes: 720p and 1080i/p.", which I'm finding confusing. In my understanding, the "p" in 720p means progressive video and the "i" in 1080i means interlaced. So what do I make of 1080i/p?
On top of this, my camera shoots in "native" mode, which drops duplicate frames used in "over 60" formats. This will give me variations in the notation like:
720/24pN
720p Native 60 fps
1080i/24p
1080/24PN
Can someone give me a quick primer about frame rate vs data rate and explain how to read these notations? I'd appreciate it quite a bit.
Thanks!

There are so many cameras, capable of so many different formats that providing a manufacturer and model could be helpful in this discussion.
Jim's answer is absolutely correct but I'm going to re-state for clarification.
The i/p designation means you can chose to record as interlaced or progressive for a given resolution.
It sounds like your camera is designed to "capture" images at 60 frames per second, selecting "native" mode means extra frames are deleted and only the desired frames, based on frame rate setting, are recorded to memory. The advantage of "native" @ 24fps is you save space on your memory card. The advantage of NOT using "native" mode is that all 60 frames per second are recorded, but the file metedata tells playback software to only show the frames needed for the specified frame rate (i.e. 24). Since all 60 frames per second are recorded, you use more memory but you also have the option of retrieving all the those frames, if you so desire, at a later time (i.e. for smoother slo-mo).
To be honest I don't know what your spec of 1080i/24p means. If that is truly an option then I would guess it means it will record a 24p image but the metedata would indicate the file should playback at 30fps interlaced by adding the proper 3:2 pulldown. This would give you that "film" look in a broadcast compatible format.
For the most part, you don't want use use any interlaced settings. Very few display devices still in use can properly display interlaced images. Interlacing is only required in some broadcast specifications.
To answer the second part of your question;
Frame rates are an indication of how many times the moving image is captured over a given period (per second). Higher frame rates means smoother, more "real life" motion. Data rates can generally be considered an indication of image or audio quality. Higher levels of compression result in lower data rates and (generally) lower quality. If squeezing more hours of footage on fewer memory cards is more important than getting the best image quality, choose a lower data rate. Higher frame rates (more images per second) inherently require a higher data rate to retain the same quality as fewer frames at a lower data rate.

Compression Data Rate.

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