Reverse telecine but footage too fast

Ola,
Here's my problem:
Captured 24p footage, reverse telecined it to 23.98. looks great, but 30% faster than before. Is there a way to change the speed to the original, either in Cinema Tools or FCP?
A.

I recall reading on here that Cinema Tools does not like reversing any clips larger than 5GBs. Since your 30 minute clip (6GBs DV) went through fine, it may not be the case, however it still could be. 40 minutes is 8GBs and might be too much. I had this same problem and had to perform a work around.
I exported smaller chunks of the big clips via Final Cut Pro as full quality DV movies, brought those into Cinema Tools, reversed them and then brought them back into Final Cut for editing.
That "not enough memory" error has been the bane of my existence and I still haven't figured out what exactly causes it or what the perfect solution is.

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24p reverse telecine

I used to be able to reverse telecine 24p footage from HVX200 camera but now its not working and people are now telling me that it only works with 24pa footage. I used 24p workflow in the past and it worked fine. What has changed? I think I used the 24p workflow before final cut supported 24pa. I already have a whole project shot in 24p and need to reverse telecine.

workflow:
shoot with HVX200 in 1080i/24p
import/transfer P2 files into FCP
Reverse Telecine to work with 24p version of footage in FCP without interlaced frames.
problem: "cinema tools reverse telecine" under the tools menu does not work as it did with same workflow in previous versions.
Ok, so it appears that the "pro-apps update 2008-05" (which updates among other things FCP to 6.0.5) is the problem. I have decided to work in 6.0.1 where the workflow works fine. Here is my troubleshooting log:
I used FCP remover to uninstall the entire studio
installed 5.0.2 and received corrupted file message when attempting to import P2 file
upgraded to 5.0.4, P2 files imported (no log and transfer in this version) successfully with a DVCPRO HD 1080i60 compression at 29.97 fps. I applied the "Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine" tool to a selected file (one of the same files I have been working with sense the beginning of this issue and will continue to use through out this troubleshooting) and it successfully processed the file resulting in a 24fps clip with no interlaced frames. YEAH!
I used software update as far as I could with this version and the workflow was still successful.
Installed 6.0.1 from CD, the workflow was still successful except the P2 files where coming in with a compression of DVCPROHD 1080p30. I don't see a problem with this. The resulting file was still 24p without any interlaced frames. And this version also has the log and transfer feature.
I ran software update and installed "Pro-Apps update 2008-05" and "Cinema Tools update 4.2.1". So I am working in FCP 6.0.5 and the problem starts. "Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine" just simply does not work. Nor does a reverse telecine work if I go directly through Cinema tools and bypass FCP with the imported P2 files (now quicktime).
I uninstall with FCS remover again.
I install 6.0.1 from the CD and perform the "Pro-Apps update 2008-05" only which takes me to 6.0.5 again. Still no good.
I uninstall with FCS remover again.
I install 6.0.1 from the CD. I don't do any updates and the workflow works great! So I will atleast do the log, transfer, and reverse telecine in this version. In the future I will shoot in 24pa, for that seems to work fine with the same workflow in 6.0.5.
I am going to leave this post as un-resolved sense Apple still needs to fix this in future versions.

Reverse Telecine 24fps Error?!?

Hi,
We've troubleshot this all ways possible, it seems, so here goes:
Our show is downconverting HD to 29.97; we're editing in 23.98 sequences. The other assistant has been able to successfully Reverse Telecine the footage (which we've batch-captured from a DVCam deck) from 29.97 to 23.98. On my system, however, when I choose the Reverse Telecine option in FCP 5.1.1, the footage ends up as 24 fps. IE, in the Video Rate column, it shows up as 24 fps.
It doesn't matter which system the footage has been captured on; on his system, if he's done the RT, then it shows up correctly as 23.98. If I RT on my system, it shows up as 24. (And any footage which he has RTed on his system correctly imports onto my system at 23.98.)
Any ideas?
We've played around with (seemingly) all the sequence/capture presets and nothing affects the above result. Otherwise, all our settings - including Cinema Tools - are set the same.
Any advice would be most helpful.
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Hi,
Thanks for your replies. We just discovered it today - there's a hidden preference in Cinema Tools where you can choose to conform to 24 or 23.98 fps; this preference is not available in Final Cut.
What you have to do is: in Cinema Tools, go to File > Open Clip, which will bring up a clip and options for Reverse-Telecine and Conform. Then, if you click on the Conform option, the next window will give you the ability to change the fps for conforming. Change to 23.98. Even if you Cancel without RTing the clip, the option will remain as whichever you selected. Then close and reopen Cinema Tools and you can Batch RT from Cinema Tools or FCP correctly.
Note that if you change the fps in the Rev Telecine option previous, the changed fps will not remain as default. Also note that you have to capture a clip (or have a movie file somewhere on the drive) in order to be able to access these preferences.
Much grief from some lousy program design.
Thanks for the help.
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Hi, I'm trying to reverse telecine some footage and I've run into a problem where the only way to do it correctly is to it manually, one clip at a time. When I run a reverse telecine on individual cips, I have the option of selecting the field order (ie AA/BB).
The problem is when I try to run a batch reverse telecine, I can no longer select the correct field order. For my particular footage I need to select the "CD" field order in order for the pulldown to be correctly removed. However, for some insane reason, I cannot select the correct field order with Batch Reverse Telecine.
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... running into the precise same problem right now. very frustrating.
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I read an article that was on Ken Stones site. It said that, basically you CAN'T
take a clip that is at 29.97 and has 3:2 pulldown in it, and get it to actual 24 progressive frames? Is this true? Has ANYONE out there actually removed pulldown CORRECTLY with footage shot at 24, then transferred to 29.97?
I've tried all options with Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine, and I always wind up with some interlacing.
My QT clip has a 3:2 cadence, one can frame through it and see this.
Am I missing something here? Does anyone know a procedure that can get me to 24 progressive frames. Is there a 3rd party piece of software out there?
Any relies appreciated.
G5 2.3 early Mac OS X (10.4.7) Cinema Tools V 3.1.1
G5 2.3 Mac OS X (10.3.8) Cinema Tools V3.1.1 QT V7.1.2 FCP V5.1.1

Well then, that is your problem. Those aren't reverse telecin-able. What are reversable are DV tapes that you captured at 29.97...in the DV/NTSC codec.
Are you working with Digital Intermediates? Or footage telecined to tape?
Typical Telecine to Tape workflow is:
Telecine to DVCAM
Lab provides DVCAM and Flex file to you.
Open Cinema Tools. Import Flex file and export batch Capture list.
Import batch capture list into FCP.
Batch Capture the DV footage.
Reverse telecine the footage with Cinema Tools.
Edit.
What exactly are you doing? Where did these files come from? What is your workflow?
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I am digitizing DVCAM tapes recorded at 29.97 (telecined from film @ 23.98) I'm cutting in a 23.98 timeline but need a correct database to go back to film. I do the normal procedure from Cinema Tools to reverse telecine, but when I bring the clip into the timeline, The A, B, C, D fields are blurred. The video plays fine, but it seems like something is wrong with the fields. Any ideas?

We shot 35 and are going back to film. The lab did the telecine and when Cinema Tools does the reverse, it converts it to 23.98, therefore I need to cut in a 23.98 timeline for it to match.
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Create a New Database
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Import the XML into FCP and Batch Capture at 29.97 from the DVCAM
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My problem is not blurred frames, but the A1, B2, C1, D2 fields in the burn-in blur when within the sequence. The video plays fine, not choppy or anything, but the burn in numbers do not play correctly.
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So I've got a bunch of footage that we shot using the 1080i 24p setting on the hvx200 which yielded 24-in-60 footage, which normally isn't a problem and the other 2 cameras we were shooting (an hv20 and hg10, both in 24p mode) produce the same kind of files. after batching everything out to compressor to remove the telecine, and convert to 1920x1080 prores, i just discovered that all the HVX footage is true 24p, but didn't remove the pulldown correctly, and most every frame is now interlaced.
I'm trying to figure out if it's a compressor issue, a dvchdpro issue, or a computer/install issue. I've had some QT plug-ins that break the reverse telecine function, but considering the hv20 and hg10 footage converted just fine i don't think it's that.
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so after sleeping on the problem, i took the footage and ran compressed it out to prores422, this time making sure to select a frame rate of 29.97 AND checking the "interlaced" button on the codec page. after batching the footage to make it true 60i, i then ran it through compressor again to remove the pulldown, and everything worked as it should. I think the problem arose from the footage reporting itself as DVCHD PRO 30P instead of 60i, and compressor wasn't seeing any fields and therefor not seeing any cadence

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I haven't a clue on how to begin searching for this.
I recently had a problem trying to get my Sony HZ5U 24p footage to true 24p instead of 30. It was causing big confusion in Color, blending frames together. Even though I placed the footage in a 24p sequence, it would just frames in unnecessary spots. And Reverse Telecine wouldn't work on footage imported by HDV - 720p24.
I was able to import to HDV-Apple ProRes 422 1080p24, Reverse Telecine, and add the clips into a HDV- 720p24 sequence to get the resolution I need...
Except there's a problem.
Something isn't working when I reverse telecine.
The clips I imported were all 2:3, two frames of the same then three others that were individual.
I "reversed" two clips which came out to 1:1 (I guess), no frames are duplicated. But a few of the clips I reversed came out to 2:2! There are two frames of the same then two others that are individual.
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I have a consistent segment I have to make each week for a program, and it's done this for the past three weeks. And on one of the clips (either the one with 1:1 or 2:2) after I send back from Color the audio is shifted off a few frames.
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Remove Advanced Pulldown and Reverse Telecine...

Hey guys,
I have read all the hundreds of postings here about problems with removing advanced pulldown. Some people mention using compressor to get the clips to 23.98. I was happy to find that indeed compressor did get the clips that I couldn't remove pulldown in FCP on to 23.98, and that those clips play on the same timeline as my other 23.98 clips. HOWEVER, the clips that were reverse telecined, then brought into FCP play with a stroby effect... There's weird horizontal lines through them. Anyone know what is going on? I guess I will start re-logging and capturing the clips as shorter clips and then try to remove the advanced pulldown on them (from what I understand FCP can't remove the pulldown if there is a cut within a clip...) but if anyone knows of an easier way to deal with this, let me know. I am working with 50 hours of footage, probably 5 of which I couldn't get the advanced pull down off of, so it's a lot of work! Thanks!

I found this answer to one of the posts about removing advanced pulldown problems:
"Are you certain it's 24PA and not 24P?
You might be able to break it into smaller chunks with QT Pro and try removing advanced pulldown on that, but that's just a shot in the dark..."
Patrick
Can someone explain how to use Quicktime Pro to break the clips into smaller chunks without going through and re-logging and capturing all over? Although, I already put all the clips that didn't get the pulldown removed in FCP through cinema tools to make them 23.98 too...I suppose this will make it impossible for me to use the QT PRo method...I am losing days of work here making smaller and smaller clips out of this material by logging and capturing over and over so I'm desperate to make sure there's not an easier way around this...
Outside of when you are tranferring to film, does anyone have a really good reason to shoot 24pA on the dvx100? With this project it was definitely a mistake!

FCP6 - been advised to use ProRes HQ but am too late for that I think

Hi Guys
I'm really confused and a bit bewildered - would really appreciate any thought whatsoever on the following.
For some bizarre reason I can't figure out yet, my rapid-edits sports sequences blur/ghost from frame to frame (like a bad frame blending) when I preview the sequence on my Dell monitor from my FCP Canvas. Also, when I choose to export to a Quicktime file using current settings, the blurring/ghosting is preserved once I view the burned DVD.
However, if I choose to select Pro Res 422 as my choice of Quicktime export file instead of keeping current settings, the ghosting seems to go away upon viewing the eventual burned DVD.
My sequence is in a standard Apple ProRes 422 Timeline. Field Dominance Upper. 25fps. HD(1440x1080)
I filmed on a PAL Canon XHA1 50i and captured this as standard Pro Res 422.
I checked the item properties of the sports clips and they match the timeline settings.
1. I have a couple of Motion clips elsewhere in the sequence which have frame size 1920 x 1080, Field Dominance None - could that cause a problem?
2. Is there a danger of losing any picture quality by choosing to export to a standard ProRes 422 1440x1080 Quicktime file rather than choosing to export using 'current settings'?
3.I have been kindly advised to recapture as ProRes HQ but this isn't really feasible for me since I'm at soundmix stage of a 50 minute project (118 one hour tapes). The video for each of the 30 second sports sequences occurs across 3-5 tapes each.
4. My main concern is that by choosing to export my QT file as standard ProRes 422 1440x1080, since it doesn't seem to ghost when I watch the video on my DVD player, will 'locking it' as standard ProRes 422 1440x1080 when I export ensure it won't ghost when playing the DVD on other people's machines?
5. If I really must, is there a way of only* re-capturing the sports footage as ProRes HQ and somehow combining that into my standard ProRes timeline with all the other footage that doesn't blur?
If you can can offer any tips at all I'd really appreciate it.
Warm regards
Peter

My guess is you've shot HDV? And your sequence is HDV Native? HDV is an interframe compression. When things change too fast, HDV sometimes can't keep up. That's my guess about your mushy frames.
When you're exporting ProRes (an intraframe format), the frames are all compressed individually.
My advice - export as ProRes and make your DVD that way. By exporting any format, you don't affect the sequence itself.
You can media manage the quick cut sequences, recapture as ProRes, then cut them back in, but if your ProRes export works, don't bother...
Patrick

Why would my video clips be running too fast when played on the monitor panel?

I posted my problem earlier today, but re-reading it maybe I didn't explain myself well enough.
My main question is: "why would my video clips be running too fast when played on the monitor panel ?". This is occuring after I have selected my media from the Tasks Panel and placed them in correct order in the Timeline/Sceneline. I knew something was wrong when I could see that the clips were not indicating their right length when viewed in the (expanded) timeline. They were compressed into just a few seconds, whereas the clips should have been at least 5 minutes. I ran the clips in the monitor and sure enough they ran too fast, with a lot of jerking movements.
The 3 video clips I am trying to make into a HD PAL video were taken with my Nokia N8 mobile video camera. These are in mp4 format. Can this present a problem ? Note that when I play these individual HD clips on my computer in (Windows Media Player) they run fine.
After I placed the clips in my Project Panel (or before in the Organize Workspace), I have perforned no change or manipulation of the clips. They are in their original state.
Just too confirm that the clips did seem to be compressed, I burnt a DVD, the resultant video ran in a matter of seconds.
Help would be greatly appreciated.

Yes, that is what the problem was.
Although the video camera on my Nokia N8, mobile was capturing at 25fps,
for some reason once transfered over to PrE9 (via file transfer), the clip was interpreted as 500fps. Once in Interpret Footage I was able to change the fps to 25.
Thanks for the help.

Reverse telecine but footage too fast

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